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      11-12-2012, 02:24 PM   #1
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Manual Transmission BMW F10 M5 Review – The Purist's M5? [Video]

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Manual Transmission 2013 BMW F10 M5 – The Purist's M5? [Video]
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This week on Ignition, Carlos Lago revisits the BMW M5 to test out something that was missing from the first test: a manual transmission. Is the 6-speed stick shift better than the standard automatic twin-clutch version?



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      11-12-2012, 02:50 PM   #2
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great vid!
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      11-12-2012, 03:44 PM   #3
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the last line pretty much sums it up. very well stated.
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      11-12-2012, 05:05 PM   #4
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I always enjoy Carlos Lago's reviews. For me personally, I haven't had the opportunity to drive a 6spd manual F10 M5 yet, but I am planning on it one day. I can instead only speak for the 7spd DCT, and I've used that transmission in all regimes including on the Nurburgring. I think he made several good points, like why would you put a 6spd manual in a 458? Which coincendentally has the same horsepower as the F10 M5. I'm not saying that rowing through the gears wouldn't be fun, but I think the 6spd manual in the F10 M5 doesn't really seem to match the nature of the car.

For me I just didn't want it because of the layout of the buttons in the lower console with the 6spd manual compared to the 7spd DCT. I also knew how incredible a DCT is after driving an M3 with the DCT a few times. It doesn't sound like BMW is even going to offer the 2014 F10 M5 with the 6spd manual either, what does that say about it? I bet there were fewer than 10% of 2013 M5's that were ordered with the 6spd manual for the American market.
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      11-12-2012, 05:37 PM   #5
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Quote:
Originally Posted by RPiM5 View Post
It doesn't sound like BMW is even going to offer the 2014 F10 M5 with the 6spd manual either, what does that say about it? I bet there were fewer than 10% of 2013 M5's that were ordered with the 6spd manual for the American market.
Not sure about 2014 M5's but SOP of 2014 M6 vert and coupes in July 13 will include 6-speed manuals per Western District Manager.

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      11-12-2012, 06:25 PM   #6
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Quote:
Originally Posted by nugent View Post
the last line pretty much sums it up. very well stated.
Profound.
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      11-12-2012, 06:28 PM   #7
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i took my road test in MT my E92 M3 is my 5th car in MT. if i got the M5 i would prob get it in MT, but the man has a point.

to me driving=using a clutch otherwise your just aiming and pushing a throttle and brake.
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      11-12-2012, 06:35 PM   #8
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458 with a 6 speed would be awesome. I bought the last of the gated manual ferraris with my f430. There is nothing like click clacking through the gears in that car and executing heel and toes turn after turn on the track in that car. with that said though, my m5 is a DCT. I enjoy both.
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      11-12-2012, 06:53 PM   #9
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I'd opt for a traditional manual over DCT. I just prefer the tactile connection with the car. What he stated from 4:25-4:40-ish are the exact reasons why manual drivers prefer manual most of the time. It's not a bad thing at all.

Last edited by Sedan_Clan; 11-12-2012 at 07:00 PM.
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      11-12-2012, 07:05 PM   #10
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Quote:
It doesn't sound like BMW is even going to offer the 2014 F10 M5 with the 6spd manual either, what does that say about it?
Source?
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      11-12-2012, 07:11 PM   #11
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Last I heard this generation F10 will have the manual, and phased out for the next. The M3 will always have a manual.
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      11-12-2012, 07:19 PM   #12
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Quote:
Originally Posted by InspireSiR
Quote:
It doesn't sound like BMW is even going to offer the 2014 F10 M5 with the 6spd manual either, what does that say about it?
Source?
Probably read that this will be the last M5 model with a manual and misunderstood that to mean last model YEAR. There's no evidence of the latter.
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      11-12-2012, 07:30 PM   #13
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Manual will always be in demand long after future M5 generations fully transition to all auto. They will surely carry higher price premium when used. You can see this with E60 M5, E46 M3 and now with newest E92 M3. Used DCT E92 M3 are cheaper or same as manual version, despite being a $3k option. '07+ E60 M5 with manual are pricier used than SMG. E46 has the widest margin probably.
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      11-12-2012, 07:41 PM   #14
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seems stupid to want a manual tranny in a 100k luxury sport sedan imo. esp since this car was designed for the DCT. if you really want that "purist" connection get a full on sports car with a MT
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      11-12-2012, 07:41 PM   #15
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Bah! 6MT for me always or I won't buy it, if this is the last year I am glad i got it and will buy m3's from now on. No disrespect but all the DCT drivers can't point and shoot their cars and use the little buttons on the steering wheel all they want.

For me it's not about going fast in a straight line, there is nothing better than downshifting on a turn from 5 to 3, with your hand and foot, and getting it perfect to fire out of the hole

Sorry you guys may make fun of me but I would rather have a connection with a car, I really cannot drive an automatic anything precisely.... I can drive it but there is no control for me. Probably has something to do with the fact that I have driven manuals all my life.

Just my opinion, I thought the review was great, he's got a sharp tongue though,
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      11-12-2012, 07:41 PM   #16
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Quote:
Originally Posted by nugent View Post
the last line pretty much sums it up. very well stated.
Yep
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      11-12-2012, 07:47 PM   #17
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Quote:
Originally Posted by malter2.0 View Post
Manual will always be in demand long after future M5 generations fully transition to all auto. They will surely carry higher price premium when used. You can see this with E60 M5, E46 M3 and now with newest E92 M3. Used DCT E92 M3 are cheaper or same as manual version, despite being a $3k option. '07+ E60 M5 with manual are pricier used than SMG. E46 has the widest margin probably.
This might have more to do with supply/demand. Remember, we're dealing with a +/- 10% take rate on most BMW MT's. So there's not much MT's in the used car market when compared to autos/DCT's.

The video makes a lot of valid points that I agree with. To me, it's not about which transmission is the best suited for the car, but it's about which transmission the driver prefers with each specific application. I think a car like an M5 deserves as much driver/car feedback as possible -- if not then I may as well go with a 550 M-Sport (and I respect that others feel differently).
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      11-12-2012, 07:53 PM   #18
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so he actually launched the car in 2nd gear?!
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      11-12-2012, 07:55 PM   #19
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Quote:
Originally Posted by RPiM5 View Post
It doesn't sound like BMW is even going to offer the 2014 F10 M5 with the 6spd manual either, what does that say about it? I bet there were fewer than 10% of 2013 M5's that were ordered with the 6spd manual for the American market.
Quote:
Originally Posted by Patsc23 View Post
Last I heard this generation F10 will have the manual, and phased out for the next. The M3 will always have a manual.
That's correct. See http://f10.m5post.com/forums/showthread.php?t=708248

BMW M engineering head recently suggested are no plans to fit the next generation M5 or M6 with a manual transmission (per link above).
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      11-12-2012, 08:01 PM   #20
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I've been driving nothing but manuals for 35 years. And even though I know that today's auto-manuals are technologically better and faster, I still love the viseral conncection of a manual. With that said, this is the best review and rational for an auto-manual that I've seen or read. It's very well done.

btw, BMW has said that the F10 will be the last M5 offered with a manual, not that the MY2013 would be the last year of an F10 M5 manual. I plan on ordering mine in Sakhir Orange as soon as I can get my hands on the MY2014 LCI!
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      11-12-2012, 08:05 PM   #21
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Quote:
Originally Posted by nugent View Post
the last line pretty much sums it up. very well stated.
Amen, brother. Not much reason for a purist to buy a 4300ish pound, $100,000, refined, elegant, twin-turbo, comfortable, luxurious, German status symbol. The DCT more suits the nature or the character of the car, if you see what I mean. Having an F10 M5 with a manual instead of DCT is like having a lawyer show up to court in jeans instead of a suit. You CAN do it, it just doesn't fit, it's not right somehow. On the other hand, a 1M or M3 would be more of the car you would WANT with a manual trans.
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      11-12-2012, 08:25 PM   #22
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I recall reading around here that BMW was working on a new design for an automated manual transmission that could be built as either an automatic or a manual. The objective is to have more than 6 ratios in this fuel efficiency focused world. I don't see how having to punch a clutch pedal at every shift helps anything. It can only lead to driver error. Perhaps this new design transmission will offer a sufficient level of involvement and control with faster and consistent shifts. Most high end cars now come equipped with some kind of a paddle shift transmission. To me, the manual seems like clinging to the past.
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