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      11-15-2014, 11:14 AM   #23
Boss330
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Quote:
Originally Posted by m-ch View Post
adding 2 things:

Sport Auto test, top speed Döttingerhöhe 295kmh.. to put it into perspective:
991 turbo S 289 kmh, mclaren 12 c 600hp version 2012 294kmh, cls 63 amp pp, 289 kmh, gtr 550hp 284 kmh rs6 c7 avant 281kmh..

Sportcars:

m5: 0-280 kmh in 26,4 sec
e63s: 0-280 kmh in 27,4 sec
rs7: 0-280 kmh in 28,2 sec

that means 0-300kmh for the m5 in approx 32 secs..
Wow!!!!

295km/h down Döttinger Höhe!!!!!!!!!

6km/h faster than a 991 Turbo S....
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      11-16-2014, 06:27 AM   #24
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I check Sport Auto site daily, looking after these numbers! Thanks for sharing
I don't understand the problem of CCB as they provide the longest distance from 200km/h braking!
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      11-16-2014, 10:11 AM   #25
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Quote:
Originally Posted by vladberca
I check Sport Auto site daily, looking after these numbers! Thanks for sharing
I don't understand the problem of CCB as they provide the longest distance from 200km/h braking!
It usually takes a long time before they publish the tests on the website. At least not before next issue is on sale...
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      11-21-2014, 08:01 AM   #26
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Updated OP with scans of the complete Supertest article
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      11-21-2014, 09:18 AM   #27
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Thnx for scanning!!
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      11-21-2014, 11:59 AM   #28
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A interesting comparison in the last issues of Sport Auto and Auto Bild Sportscars. Sport Auto tests the M5 CP while Auto Bild Sportscars test the M5 30 Jahre.

Both magazines do dyno testing. Sport Auto use MAHA. Auto Bild use INSORIC, which is not a chassis dynometer, but uses wheel sensors, barometric data, weight of vehicle, tire diameter to measure acceleration and rolling power. The INSORIC has been VERY accurate in testing and has the benefit of testing the car under it's normal conditions. Cooling, air resistance, rolling resistance etc is as under normal everyday driving conditions. I also happen to have the INSORIC test equipment myself (received it about a month ago) and can confirm it's accuracy, even when tested on a wide variety of vehicles.

Noteworthy is it that Sport Auto do not use any correction factor since the DME allready does this correction. Exactly the double dipping effect we discussed in a different thread.

The interesting thing is the difference in measured power on these two dynos...

The M5 CP is supposed to have 575PS / 680Nm
The M5 30 is supposed to have 600PS / 700Nm

M5 CP measured on a MAHA chassis dyno 649PS / 760Nm
M5 30 measured on INSORIC "road" dyno 607PS / 734Nm


The M5 CP apparently makes 74PS / 80Nm more than stated!!! A significant 12,8% more than official numbers!!! This dyno result also implies that the CP actually is 42PS and 26Nm stronger than the supposedly more powerful M5 30 Jahre...

So, could the M5 CP have been a "press car" as Sport Auto discussed in their editorial, or does it really make that much power stock?

Let's look at the acceleration numbers posted in both magazines, that should at least give us a clue as to their relative power level.

M5 CP:

0-100km/h: 4,2s
0-160km/h: 8,4s
0-200km/h: 12,6s

80-120km/h:
5th gear: 4,4s
6th gear: 5,6s
7th gear: 8,5s


M5 30 Jahre:

0-100km/h: 4,0s
0-160km/h: 7,9s
0-200km/h: 11,8s

80-120km/h:
5th gear: 4,2s
6th gear: 5,2s
7th gear: 7,4s


So, in every acceleration test above, the M5 30 Jahre is quicker, as it should be! Between 0,2s to 1,1s quicker than the M5 CP actually.

Considering the M5 CP, according to the MAHA, should have 42PS more than the 30 Jahre, the results doesn't make sense... In fact, what doesn't make sense are the relative dyno results... IMO, the INSORIC result at 607PS seems plausible. It's just 7PS more than BMW claims for the car. The MAHA result on the other hand makes no sense at all in this context... Not only does the MAHA report a massive underrating, it even implies that the 575PS M5 CP is stronger than the 600PS M5 30 Jahre...

This just illustrates the flaws of chassis dynos. Real world acceleration numbers prove the opposite of what the MAHA/INSORIC dyno sheets say. The INSORIC almost measures spot on what BMW claims while the MAHA tells a different story. Regardless of which dyno is correct, the relative measurements are way off...

To me, one more example that dyno measurements are to be taken with many grains of salt
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      11-21-2014, 12:39 PM   #29
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Boss330
A interesting comparison in the last issues of Sport Auto and Auto Bild Sportscars. Sport Auto tests the M5 CP while Auto Bild Sportscars test the M5 30 Jahre.

Both magazines do dyno testing. Sport Auto use MAHA. Auto Bild use INSORIC, which is not a chassis dynometer, but uses wheel sensors, barometric data, weight of vehicle, tire diameter to measure acceleration and rolling power. The INSORIC has been VERY accurate in testing and has the benefit of testing the car under it's normal conditions. Cooling, air resistance, rolling resistance etc is as under normal everyday driving conditions. I also happen to have the INSORIC test equipment myself (received it about a month ago) and can confirm it's accuracy, even when tested on a wide variety of vehicles.

Noteworthy is it that Sport Auto do not use any correction factor since the DME allready does this correction. Exactly the double dipping effect we discussed in a different thread.

The interesting thing is the difference in measured power on these two dynos...

The M5 CP is supposed to have 575PS / 680Nm
The M5 30 is supposed to have 600PS / 700Nm

M5 CP measured on a MAHA chassis dyno 649PS / 760Nm
M5 30 measured on INSORIC "road" dyno 607PS / 734Nm


The M5 CP apparently makes 74PS / 80Nm more than stated!!! A significant 12,8% more than official numbers!!! This dyno result also implies that the CP actually is 42PS and 26Nm stronger than the supposedly more powerful M5 30 Jahre...

So, could the M5 CP have been a "press car" as Sport Auto discussed in their editorial, or does it really make that much power stock?

Let's look at the acceleration numbers posted in both magazines, that should at least give us a clue as to their relative power level.

M5 CP:

0-100km/h: 4,2s
0-160km/h: 8,4s
0-200km/h: 12,6s

80-120km/h:
5th gear: 4,4s
6th gear: 5,6s
7th gear: 8,5s


M5 30 Jahre:

0-100km/h: 4,0s
0-160km/h: 7,9s
0-200km/h: 11,8s

80-120km/h:
5th gear: 4,2s
6th gear: 5,2s
7th gear: 7,4s


So, in every acceleration test above, the M5 30 Jahre is quicker, as it should be! Between 0,2s to 1,1s quicker than the M5 CP actually.

Considering the M5 CP, according to the MAHA, should have 42PS more than the 30 Jahre, the results doesn't make sense... In fact, what doesn't make sense are the relative dyno results... IMO, the INSORIC result at 607PS seems plausible. It's just 7PS more than BMW claims for the car. The MAHA result on the other hand makes no sense at all in this context... Not only does the MAHA report a massive underrating, it even implies that the 575PS M5 CP is stronger than the 600PS M5 30 Jahre...

This just illustrates the flaws of chassis dynos. Real world acceleration numbers prove the opposite of what the MAHA/INSORIC dyno sheets say. The INSORIC almost measures spot on what BMW claims while the MAHA tells a different story. Regardless of which dyno is correct, the relative measurements are way off...

To me, one more example that dyno measurements are to be taken with many grains of salt
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      08-15-2016, 08:04 AM   #30
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I was just surfing the net and happen to see Sport Auto International has the M5 CP test now in English. Since probably 99% of us here doesn't understand German and Google translate doesn't do a good job, it was nice to see SA has their own translation (though parts of it still don't sounded right)

For those who doesn't want to read the whole article, here are the key points (besides 640HP which there are discussion on it already):

- Even though 0-200km barely differs from the non CP model they tested before, above 200km is where the additional power is felt.

- Is still heavy at 1,895kg

- Friendlier at the limit, non CP version has abrupt transition from static to sliding. New softer torque allocation to the drive wheel facilities the driver in controlling the vehicle.

- Major issue with ABS intervenes too early. On a short circuit like Hockenheim, where tires and brakes plays a considerable role, for some reason either the M5's tire themselves are over-exerted or because the rear makes small contribution to the braking performance, the ABS is left holding the baby. And given the high load at the front, the ABS begins its work early, which resulted in the considerable lengthening of the braking distance.

- Unfortunately the improvement BMW made with handling and increased HP was wasted though poor braking on the Hockenheim track. This car is equipped with ceramic brakes but the performance is not ground breaking. That said, the brakes themselves are not to blame, it is the brake balance and the unsuccessful adaptation of the ABS to suit the tyre.

- However, on the Nordschleife, the M5 CP showed the full force of its power and improved drivability, the ABS interventions in Hockenheim are hardly relevant here, 262km/h heading towards the Schwedenkreuz section, 230km/h up the Kesselchen, and then just under 300km/h on Dotting Hohe. M5 CP dropped 11 seconds from 8:05 to 7:54. The power of the biturbo engine could in many respects be considered offensive.

Last edited by Phatcat; 08-15-2016 at 10:38 AM..
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      08-15-2016, 09:15 PM   #31
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^^^ The F10 M5 needs better rear calipers- wish they had brake shoes in the disc hat/bell so we could easliy change them to a better multi pistion design.
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      08-15-2016, 10:54 PM   #32
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Quote:
Originally Posted by ur20v View Post
^^^ The F10 M5 needs better rear calipers- wish they had brake shoes in the disc hat/bell so we could easliy change them to a better multi pistion design.
Yeah I do not understand why M5 has such small rear callipers, even the Ceramic version, and they are not cheaper than Porsche's either, you would think it will be impressive like Porsche's.

Last edited by Phatcat; 08-16-2016 at 12:51 AM..
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