Disappointing test drive experience

[bbbradley]

Greetings!! Another newbie in the ranks, but I come from a BMW past and am a 10+ year BMWCCA member so

I owned an e36 328i but sold it a while back when my job had me driving a ton. I'm in the market to replace my current winter/poor weather car (Audi A4 TQ) to complement a Miata and have the 1 series on my list (along with the RX-8, WRX, and possibly a couple others, but this is my list for now). The dimensions of the 1 are similar to the e36, a car I very much enjoyed and am hoping to find something similar to (I had a sedan versus the coupe), that said I left my first 128i test drive very disappointed.

The dealer I went to in the suburban Boston area had exactly 0 manual transmission cars on the lot, and exactly 0 sport package equipped cars on the lot. WTF! Ultimate driving machine? Not according to this dealer inventory. Couple it with a chaperoned test drive that forced me to avoid a road I know well that would give me a bit of exposure to the chassis without driving like an a$$clown on public streets.

A few questions based on this as I am not yet ready to toss the 128 off my list.

1) Does the sport package really transform this car? The base model felt...Camry-eque to put it bluntly. I drove to the dealer in my Miata with mild suspension modifications, but still a very streetable car, so that was what I was basing my opinion upon. My e36 had the sport package, and granted it was 10 years ago, I recall it being much sharper.

2) How much headroom might I gain going from a base (with what I thought were horrible seats!!) with moonroof to a sport seat and no-moonroof car? My hair was brushing the headliner, I am ~6"1" and don't have a Fletch-esque afro a la Chevy Chase.

3) I assume the slushbox sucks the sport out of the car too. How is the gearbox on this car? I bounce back and forth between the A4 and the Miata, both have 5-spds in them. While the Audi is nothing special, it is smooth and direct feeling, the Miata is just a whole different animal that I don't expect to get in the 128.

After driving the 128i base/slushy, the RX8 blew it out of the water. I know this is not apples to apples hence my question. I wish the local dealer had something even somewhat sporty on the lot to give me a better first impression.

The Subie dealer had a 10-15 person line...I'll come back another day.

TIA!!

[KingOfJericho]

Go to another dealer. Additionally, a RWD 128i is really not a suitable replacement for winter duties. I drive my 135i in the snow with dedicated winter tires but a RWD car with even all seasons is not very practical for winter driving.

[alexckma]

if you want a sport coupe, I much prefer the 370z, audi tts, or z4 over the 128

I myself prefer 128 cuz I dont like the really hard suspension

[bbbradley]

Will this car handle appreciably worse than the e36? I put four dedicated snow tires on that car and believe it was one of my favorite winter cars. I took it skiing on a regular basis; Blizzaks 100% transform the car into a winter demon!

A car with good handling on the dry is as much of an asset in snow/wet.

[KingOfJericho]

A RWD car, regardless of tires, is not a "winter demon." It might be tolerable in the snow but it will never compare to an AWD or 4WD car. I used to drive a 318is to the train station in the snow and it would manage alright but going up a hill from a stop it would always struggle as any RWD would.

[bbbradley]

Originally Posted by KingOfJericho

A RWD car, regardless of tires, is not a "winter demon." It might be tolerable in the snow but it will never compare to an AWD or 4WD car. I used to drive a 318is to the train station in the snow and it would manage alright but going up a hill from a stop it would always struggle as any RWD would.

AWD will generally be superior, all else equal, but AWD usually comes with a weight penalty and not all AWDs are equal (Quattro vs Haldex). I still believe with 4 good snow tires most any car can be a very competent winter vehicle.

[KingOfJericho]

I'll only go so far as to say tolerable but if you feel confident then by all means, go for it. The real solution for you would be to try another dealer. Most of us on here have 135s which are sporty no matter how you slice it. The car is fast as all get out and handles decently after turn-in. I've never driven a 128i but I would imagine a sport pkg car will be a little different.

[cvandenhaute]

I bought the 128i looking for something bringing me the closest fun to the Miata (I had a 2007) but with a back seat.
In order to answer your questions, the sport package definitely improves the car (I have it with sport pack, drove it with and without) without making it too harsch.
The manual is a HUGE improvement in fun vs the GM auto you find in the 128i, I found that the auto was killing the fun, I am very happy with mine but keep in mind that even if it is very good, it is not as perfect as the shifter of the Miata.

I drove a RX8 right after the 128 and I found both very similar (but the RX8 is a tad more precise) in sensations. I liked the sound of the six in line better than the rotary engine and I cared more for the interior of the BMW, plus I was concerned about the mileage and oil consumption of the RX8...

As far as winter is concerned, too early to tell for me, I just mounted my winter tires but their behavior over frozen roads a few days ago made me very confident, more than my previous 4WD VW R32 with all season tires...

I would try to find one at another dealership (good luck, I was lucky enough to have it done more than one year ago because all I could try this year was a 128i auto and a 135i manual, and the 128i manual is very different in character than both).

Just an observation from me after 5000 miles : I feel that the engine changes a lot over the miles, it feels more open and alive now than at the beginning. I never experienced such a change over miles with any of my previous car. Feels like a good wine to me!!!!

[Raine]

Sport Pkg and Manual makes a huge difference.

Oh yea the Sport seats are amazing.

[3liter1]

I currently own both a 2005 (B6) S4 Tiptronic and a 2009 128i Msport. Without going into too many details here (no time right now) I dont want to drive the Audi anymore (it is a 3rd car in the family for college kids away at college). That said,the 128, even with sport, will not be the RX8 in terms of handling. I test drove that car too. However, with the fold down seats, trunk space, etc, the 128i is a very practical alternative. Check out the posts here of those who have ordered the car with the performance suspension up front. You can save some real $$ doing that. I am leasing the car, and if i keep it, it would be a strong consideration. Even the sport suspension feels a bit "soft" for me. And I am comparing that to the S4. I've tracked both cars, and the 128i is MUCH better (more fun), even though the S4 would beat it around the track. Sounds like you may know what I mean, given your Miata.

[bmwmike335]

Drive the 128i with the Msport pkg and youll be back here posting a new topic about ur new 128i coupe =)

yes its a world of difference between base, sport and even M sport.
not to mention a 6mt, its a diff car. one thing i realized with my car, is that even though it doesnt have a _35 power and all that, BMW still takes pride in their products and the 128i with the M pkg truly is worthy of carrying the M logos. same for a 128i base, its not a POS just for the mere fact that its a BMW and they maintain their image, quality and branding. anyway, i digressed..

drive a sport, but maybe consider a better winter suitable car.

RAWRRR

[gnat]

From my test drives, the 128 is a very capable and fun car. Sport and manual are a must.

If you don't have another nearby dealer with better selection, see if one of them has a 328i with manual and the sport package (xi won't work as it doesn't get the suspension bits). Better still if they have a non-sport + slush 328i you can drive too. That'll give you a better idea of what the N52 can do and what the suspension feels like. I find the 128 better due to it's smaller wheel base.

As far as going out with the CA in the car, I have no problem helping them get acquainted with the grab bar on the door Most seem to be pretty good about letting you pick the route as long as it's not too far or too much risk (e.g. gravel roads).

If you are approaching it as a "winter" car, I would actually suggest looking at the 328xi if you can handle the extra cash. It's a fat pig compared to the 3s of the e28 - e36 days, but it is still a pretty decent performer and it just sticks to the road. That's not to diminish the 1s in the winter, I am just a big fan of AWD performance cars.

[nordique14]

I can answer some of your questions. I had an E36 328ic (with sport suspension) prior to my 135ic.

The sport package will help but it will not transform the car. Going from all-seasons on the non-sport to the summer tires on the sport will make the biggest handling difference. The rest of the sport suspension is an incremental improvement. The 128i auto is awful and the manual will make the car feel much more spirited. Combined with the sticker summer tires, I suspect you will feel a big difference in personality from non-sport auto to sport manual.

Compared to the 328i, the 328i was a better drive. The 328i clutch was heavier (the 1xx clutch is very light by comparison). The 328i steering felt sharper too (although it did have too many turns lock-to-lock). Just as the E36 was more refined a driving experience than the E30, the E82 is a more refined driving experience than the E36. That is just progress and how you sell more cars to the masses.

That said, the E82 is a well sized car and probably one of the best choices in its class. As you mentioned it is about the same size as the E36. The manual transmission still shifts very well (other than the touchy 1-2 shift) and you will get used to the lighter clutch. What you do get over the E36 is much better headlights (the xenons are far superior to the crappy E36 lights), much better sound (the E36 stereo was awful) and a more solid feeling car.

[cpippolo]

Having owned two Miatas and one RX-8, I can tell you that they are all fine in the winter with proper snow tires. The 128 w/sport package cannot touch the RX-8 handling (the RX-8 does not understeer and is very easy to rotate) or gearbox (RX-8 gearbox is at least as good as Miata, maybe better). RX-8 has slightly less headroom, slightly more leg room. Suicide doors on RX-8 are either great or a pain depending on how tight the parking space is. One area where I think the 128 and 135 blow the RX-8 away is in engine performance. While the RX-8 has a 9000 rpm red line, you have to use pretty much all of it to get that power, which is a pain in day to day driving (although fun when you are really getting on it and can keep the revs above 7000). The BMW straight six performs much better and actually gets much better gas mileage.

[Hexley]

I live in Florida, it never gets below 40F here, so the 128i M-Sport is amazing for my needs... but if you're looking for a winter car, I'd go Audi Quattro or something

[GaryS]

No, a 135i or 128i with sport suspension cannot handle like an RX-8. Even with the Performance suspension, it will still not handle like an RX-8. Likewise, even with the Performance short-shifter, the 1-series gearbox is not in the same league with an RX-8.

But are you willing to give up that much power? And would you be happy in the RX-8's very claustrophobic interior?

Also, since you're talking about snow, RX-8 ground clearance is only 4.7". I don't know what how high the stock 128i is, but my 135i was 5.5" stock and 5.1" with Performance springs. My personal opinion is that anything lower than 5" is a pain in the ass for daily driving.

[Tom K.]

Definitely try to find a ZSP 128i to drive as I felt it made a significant difference in handling without sacrifing much in ride comfort. Don't worry about trying to drive a 6 sp MT - just order the car with it and you will not be disappointed.

I cannot speak to headroom as my 'vert has all I need - top up or down.

Tom

[bbbradley]

Thanks for the comments, I am surprised at the number of 128/RX8 cross shoppers who owned e36s.

Odd the comments about the RX8 interior space and headroom; the 128i interior felt more cramped and my head brushed the headliner in this car whereas I was no where near the roof in the RX8.

I need to find a M Sport 128i, ideally a MT, but the suspension/seats are what would be a key factor here. Sadly the other partner dealer they suggested is in a much more urban setting, nothing like the typical driving I do. If I go I'll tell the chaperon to either pack some food, or stay at the dealer as I need to find some better roads than what is in the immediate vicinity.

I'm baffled by the number of people here scared to drive a RWD in the winter. A well balanced car that allows you to steer with the throttle is the ultimate winter car. IMO at least.

[SlicktopTTZ]

I wouldn't get a 128i, especially as a winter car.

[bbbradley]

Originally Posted by SlicktopTTZ

I wouldn't get a 128i, especially as a winter car.

How much snow does Corpus Christi, Texas get?

[SlicktopTTZ]

Originally Posted by bbbradley

How much snow does Corpus Christi, Texas get?

I tried driving my 135 M-sport manual through a week of snow while living in Denton during December. Maybe twice my car was able to get out of the parking lot of our apartment.

It was on stock summer run-flats though. My main gripe is that stupid open diff, it doesn't do SHIT when there is no traction. An LSD would be a must for me if I was to purchase a RWD winter car.

If you want a nice summer cruiser though, 135 M-sport 6-speed with tune/meth is hard to beat. It also runs decent autocross times stock.

My first mod after being satisfied with the power would be camber plates.

[KingOfJericho]

Originally Posted by bbbradley

I'm baffled by the number of people here scared to drive a RWD in the winter. A well balanced car that allows you to steer with the throttle is the ultimate winter car. IMO at least.

I don't think anyone here is "scared" to drive their cars in the winter but we'd be lying to say it's the most capable car for the job. The way you phrased your original post made it sound like the primary function of the vehicle would be winter and poor weather for which a RWD is not *optimal* in the same way that I can cut a tree down with a steak knife but I'd rather use an axe - you feel me?