Hmm 2016 CTS-V

[pochesq]

Something to consider when my lease is up. http://gmauthority.com/blog/2014/10/...l-on-the-ring/

[mainly]

geez looks like they tried to copy an e63 for the front. everything else is lol.

who does gm hire for their designers? 4th graders?

[RPiM5]

I was just thinking about the 2016 CTS-V last night too. You read my mind. It is the next thing to come out as far as Super Saloons go.

A few observations after watching the video.

- Its definitely going to have a V8.
- it's definitely going to be supercharged. I could hear the supercharger whine in the video.
- it's going to be a big car. After watching that F86 X6M fly past it, you could get a sense of how big the Caddy is.
- It really didn't seem to have too much body roll after watching it do a slalom on the Ring.

The next CTS-V will be an interesting car for sure. I just wish Jaguar would make a 4 door version of its Coupe R to compete in the market too. Lol!

[pochesq]

Originally Posted by RPiM5

I was just thinking about the 2016 CTS-V last night too. You read my mind. It is the next thing to come out as far as Super Saloons go.

A few observations after watching the video.

- Its definitely going to have a V8.
- it's definitely going to be supercharged. I could hear the supercharger whine in the video.
- it's going to be a big car. After watching that F86 X6M fly past it, you could get a sense of how big the Caddy is.
- It really didn't seem to have too much body roll after watching it do a slalom on the Ring.

The next CTS-V will be an interesting car for sure. I just wish Jaguar would make a 4 door version of its Coupe R to compete in the market too. Lol!

Dave. Good observations. The Jaguar Coupe R is a beast. Do you know how the Jaguar XFR-S compares to the M5 or E63?

[RPiM5]

Originally Posted by pochesq

Dave. Good observations. The Jaguar Coupe R is a beast. Do you know how the Jaguar XFR-S compares to the M5 or E63?

The Jag XFR / XFR-S is in the same market league as the M5 / RS7 / E63, but has never really been a real competitor. Sure the XFR-S looks impressive on paper, but it lacks a lot of the good engineering that went into the F10 M5 and even the Jag Coupe R. I like the XFR and XFR-S for what Jaguar tried to accomplish with them but could never find myself owning one as my only car.

Carlos Lago did an excellent review on one.

What I do like about the XFR-S is their extreme rarity though. Like Carlos said in the video only 100 of them were brought to the U.S. Luckily I've even found one for sale in my favorite color, French Racing Blue. Look at the sales price though, so cheap!

http://www.cars.com/vehicledetail/de...2797824/photo/

The truth is that the Jaguar XFR and XFR-S tries to concentrate too much on performance while putting the other things on the backburner, like technology, comfort, utility and luxury. These are things that BMW, Audi, and Mercedes do very well, and is another reason why for Cadillac, those customers only seeking to buy a bargain performance saloon pick the CTS-V over an M5.

I've heard it been said before that the Jaguar F-Type Coupe R is like the British version of the American Corvette, well if that is true comparison, then the Jaguar XFR-S is more akin to the Dodge Charger SRT than it is to real Luxury Sports Sedans. It's just not a competitor.

[RPiM5]

Then again I could be completely wrong. LOL!!!!

[SocalBM]

It's funny you say that Jag puts performance ahead of all of the other factors, yet is dead last in every single performance measure compared to the competition (talking about the XFR-S in regards to M, AMG, RS cars, before someone jumps on me about the F-Type).

Regarding the CTS-V: it's going to be a beast right out of the box and likely at the very top world-wide. But, like all GM cars, will be a breeze to mod and tune and with a pulley swap, tune, and longtubes is probably going to be in the 650-700whp range and be lighter than the rest (the new sedan platform at GM is considerably lighter than it used to be and beating German and Japanese segment rivals).

All-in-all; more great options for car lovers.

[The Goose]

The main question mark for me is will Cadillac step up in the luxury department?GM tends to lack in the department but excels in performance part. As an owner of multiple GM cars, 2 Z06's, 2 Denali's and a Duramax Crew Cab, they need to work on this to earn my business. In 2011 I had the choice of buying a CTS V or 550i M sport. I choose the BMW because the fit, finish and technology superseded the performance. Had it been 5 years prior in my mid to late 20's it would have been the CTS V.

Funny as I get older the performance part of the equation stays the same or decreases a tad and I lean towards the total package. Too me that's what the M5 has over the other sport saloons in its class. And if I want all out muscle I have my choice weapons in the garage...and buying a 2012-2013 Z06 or ZR1 seems mighty attractive right now.

[RPiM5]

Originally Posted by SocalBM

It's funny you say that Jag puts performance ahead of all of the other factors, yet is dead last in every single performance measure compared to the competition (talking about the XFR-S in regards to M, AMG, RS cars, before someone jumps on me about the F-Type).

Regarding the CTS-V: it's going to be a beast right out of the box and likely at the very top world-wide. But, like all GM cars, will be a breeze to mod and tune and with a pulley swap, tune, and longtubes is probably going to be in the 650-700whp range and be lighter than the rest (the new sedan platform at GM is considerably lighter than it used to be and beating German and Japanese segment rivals).

All-in-all; more great options for car lovers.

Originally Posted by ericg69ss

The main question mark for me is will Cadillac step up in the luxury department?GM tends to lack in the department but excels in performance part. As an owner of multiple GM cars, 2 Z06's, 2 Denali's and a Duramax Crew Cab, they need to work on this to earn my business. In 2011 I had the choice of buying a CTS V or 550i M sport. I choose the BMW because the fit, finish and technology superseded the performance. Had it been 5 years prior in my mid to late 20's it would have been the CTS V.

Funny as I get older the performance part of the equation stays the same or decreases a tad and I lean towards the total package. Too me that's what the M5 has over the other sport saloons in its class. And if I want all out muscle I have my choice weapons in the garage...and buying a 2012-2013 Z06 or ZR1 seems mighty attractive right now.

Precisely. I agree. I think that the new CTS-V will be lighter than todays super saloons and will come with more power. However, I don't think that it will be too much more power. The latest rumors put the next CTS-V at using the new engine in the C7 Vette ZO6, which is at about 640hp. I've heard that Cadillac will probably de-tune the engine from that. American cars have always been easy to mod for more power. Just look at the work Hennessey does. But will the next CTS-V have a Power Close Trunk? How about 4 Zone Climate Control? Or Rear Seat Entertainment? Will it have Soft Close Doors? Heads Up Display? Full Comfort Access? A Premium Sound System? Split Fold Down Rear Seats? A navigation system with a high quality resolution? How about Night Vision? Surround View Cameras? I doubt that it will have any of these luxury, comfort, and convenience features. When the next CTS-V comes out as a 2016 model, the next M5 will only be a couple of years away. There's already talk of the next M5 incorporating luxury and technology on never before seen levels in a mid-sized sedan. Semi-Autonomous driving, hybrid assist drive trains, carbon fiber chassis construction just to name a few. The next CTS-V will be a beast no doubt, it might even be a better track car than the F10 M5, but that's all it will be better at.

[stealth.pilot]

Originally Posted by RPiM5

Wow, I'm all for competition and everything but sometimes I feel like some company's should know when to quit while they are ahead. Especially given all the turmoil this year over recalls on American made cars and the negligence of those companys. I'm also willing to bet that Tesla is having a huge impact on American made Compact and Mid-Size Sedans here in the U.S. Tesla is growing at a phenomenal rate too. Times are changing. BMW seems to have taken the right gamble with it's i Program and that will help sustain them for decades to come. Especially with the plans for making base BMW models with hybrid drive trains and not making them special hybrid models in the future. Although Corvette sales have been very good.

Cadillac doesn't seem to have learned. I remember when the last CTS came out I went to the Caddy dealer to check it out. While there I saw an STS V8 Platinum, 9 months old previous model year with 7k miles. Original MSRP was 60,000 and they were selling it for 29,000. 50% depreciation in less than a year.

I have to say that this is my fear a little with the Z06. I would hate to pay MSRP early if they overproduce.

They aren't back at that level with the CTS but depending on how they clear that 215 day inventory it may end up becoming like that.

Jaguar did it right - very conservative with the forecast, no excess inventory, 6 month wait for an F-Type in many parts of the country.

[RPiM5]

Originally Posted by stealth.pilot

Cadillac doesn't seem to have learned. I remember when the last CTS came out I went to the Caddy dealer to check it out. While there I saw an STS V8 Platinum, 9 months old previous model year with 7k miles. Original MSRP was 60,000 and they were selling it for 29,000. 50% depreciation in less than a year.

I have to say that this is my fear a little with the Z06. I would hate to pay MSRP early if they overproduce.

They aren't back at that level with the CTS but depending on how they clear that 215 day inventory it may end up becoming like that.

Jaguar did it right - very conservative with the forecast, no excess inventory, 6 month wait for an F-Type in many parts of the country.

Stealth check this out man. Ridiculous!

http://blog.caranddriver.com/unplugg...bill-into-law/

[E90potentialbuyer]

Originally Posted by RPiM5

Stealth check this out man. Ridiculous!

http://blog.caranddriver.com/unplugg...bill-into-law/

It's ridiculous. I am a petrol head and not necessarily a tesla advocate. But this kind of behavior is despicable. Let tesla be tesla. It's changing the game in car tech and sales model - something I admire them for. Why shouldn't I just be able to order my car online and cut the BS with the dealer?

[stealth.pilot]

Originally Posted by RPiM5

Stealth check this out man. Ridiculous!

http://blog.caranddriver.com/unplugg...bill-into-law/

This is ridiculous. Makes me really angry.

[Fantasm]

Originally Posted by RPiM5

Stealth check this out man. Ridiculous!

http://blog.caranddriver.com/unplugg...bill-into-law/

What kind of stupid law says that the manufacturer can't sell direct to consumer?
You HAVE to have a middle man? WTF?

[Salespunk]

Has anyone actually sat in the new CTS V Sport yet? I haven't driven it, but they did a much better job on the interior. They also dropped nearly 300 lbs with the redesign. If it gets the Z06 motor I doubt they will detune it.

I do rent ATS' sometimes when I travel and it is a lot of fun to drive. Very similar in feel to the new 3 series I just got for my daughter. Will be getting my son an ATS in the next few months so we will have both in the household. There are a few details they are missing on the ATS to fully overtake the 3 series, but it is very close right now.

Overall I would not discount the CTS-V yet. Look at the quantum leap they made between the first and second generations. The third generation is as big or an even bigger jump in the right direction. I do believe they made a serious pricing error on the new CTS and ELR. The CTS was simply too big of a jump and the ELR is just priced too high. Those are causing the inventory gluts, but not the quality of the product.

[elitex]

wow, that is cheap for a fairly rare vehicle.

[Trakrzy]

Originally Posted by RPiM5

The truth is that the Jaguar XFR and XFR-S tries to concentrate too much on performance while putting the other things on the backburner, like technology, comfort, utility and luxury. These are things that BMW, Audi, and Mercedes do very well, and is another reason why for Cadillac, those customers only seeking to buy a bargain performance saloon pick the CTS-V over an M5. .

I think it's perhaps a matter of aesthetics more than anything else when it comes to the interior of the XFRS.

But technology wise I think it's comparable. My main complaint is the size of the infotainment screen and it's interface...it's a little dated. But you have ACC, BT streaming, blind spot etc...

Otherwise after driving it back to back with an f10( I had an E60 M) I think the RS is a bit livelier to drive. Lease programs were cheap a couple of months ago. I'm quite happy with mine. One odd mention is the surprisingly good fuel economy, averaging similar fuel mileage to my old 335i.

[PhilT3]

Caddy?... Powerful...? Sure. But lack of refinement. So if you value more than just power, look elsewhere.

[soooma]

Originally Posted by stealth.pilot

This is ridiculous. Makes me really angry.

What a shame!!
GM must be scared then! !

[stealth.pilot]

Thought this was funny.

http://blog.caranddriver.com/manches...ree-corvettes/

[RPiM5]

Originally Posted by stealth.pilot

Thought this was funny.

http://blog.caranddriver.com/manches...ree-corvettes/

I wonder if any of those soccer players drives an M5? Lol!

[stealth.pilot]

Originally Posted by RPiM5

I wonder if any of those soccer players drives an M5? Lol!

My guess is the answer is yes but only if it has full leather!