The Force was too strong...slipped to the Dark Side

[Bimmer6]

Originally Posted by Ftc120

Whether I am new here or not is a mute issue, I didn't realize this was like being in the local teamsters/union. To the car being heavy and tail happy that is a matter of opinion and driver ability. Again the M 5 being to heavy or tail happy, well I guess that's subjective. Of course if your driving a smaller lighter car you are going to feel more confident in your driving abilities.

P.S. - I guess in order to offer a honest opinion on this forum in regards to comparing two totally different cars you need to have spent at least $ 300,000.00 in vehicles to be in the club, when you do that you become a car authority and you are allowed to post on this forum.

Of course not, to your point you have not driven the car on a track probably never intend too! Some of us have had many M cars, and track time so we do have an opinion right. Dude you just discredited a M driver with over 10k hours in track time. 500 lbs of torque will eat up a tranny ......better yet good driver leave of the DSC while your trying to keep the monster on the ground(:

[ColdList]

Originally Posted by Rob///M5

The word is moot

Hahahaha Rob! I was going to post EXACTLY the same thing!

[ColdList]

Originally Posted by Ftc120

Whether I am new here or not is a mute issue, I didn't realize this was like being in the local teamsters/union. To the car being heavy and tail happy that is a matter of opinion and driver ability. Again the M 5 being to heavy or tail happy, well I guess that's subjective. Of course if your driving a smaller lighter car you are going to feel more confident in your driving abilities.

P.S. - I guess in order to offer a honest opinion on this forum in regards to comparing two totally different cars you need to have spent at least $ 300,000.00 in vehicles to be in the club, when you do that you become a car authority and you are allowed to post on this forum.

And I was trying to post a compromising and friendly response...

How can the issue of a 4300 lb car being heavy be subjective? A car that wags its tail around when cornering when driven by amateurs AND professionals being tail happy-also subjective?

I have owned an E60 M5, and F10 M5 and an F12 M6. It does not make me some sort of snob. It does not make me better than anyone. It does however give a considerable frame of reference from which to speak. The fact is, that my F10 M5 was very prone to slip the tail on turns under any acceleration whatsoever in any sort ofmcondotions. I learned to control it and it was a BLAST. It was however unavoidable in most instances. My M6 does the same. There is really no question about this. Both cars also like to spin the tires a good amount during a launch. In MDM the spinning is more limited but there is a lot of interference for the traction control. I cannot see any legitimate argument to this.

And as for your mistaken interpretation that my comment about you being new here had any negative connotation-what I was trying to state in a friendly and amusing manner was that because you are new you may not have had the opportunity yet to read through the forums and see how many crazy heated discussions have been stirred up with the argument about whether a manual or a DCT is better. It is like stirring up a tornado around here. So THAT is why people who have been here for some length of time vs a newbie may have some additional insights. That is all.

Man your little voice in the back of your head sure attaches ridiculous meaning to things.

[ColdList]

Originally Posted by Ftc120

Can't wait to hear what the next latest and greatest super car is in two months when you become bored with the Porsche. That's when the Porsche becomes old news ?

My friend, at this point YOU are old news. I am also assuming that you are quite young based upon the childish emotional tone of your responses. Please stop posting comments that have no value or contribution to the discussion whatsoever. This is not a place for silly arguments and you are simply trashing my thread. Start your own if you like and see if you can get others to play along.

[Pazzo009]

Originally Posted by ColdList

And I was trying to post a compromising and friendly response...

How can the issue of a 4300 lb car being heavy be subjective? A car that wags its tail around when cornering when driven by amateurs AND professionals being tail happy-also subjective?

I have owned an E60 M5, and F10 M5 and an F12 M6. It does not make me some sort of snob. It does not make me better than anyone. It does however give a considerable frame of reference from which to speak. The fact is, that my F10 M5 was very prone to slip the tail on turns under any acceleration whatsoever in any sort ofmcondotions. I learned to control it and it was a BLAST. It was however unavoidable in most instances. My M6 does the same. There is really no question about this. Both cars also like to spin the tires a good amount during a launch. In MDM the spinning is more limited but there is a lot of interference for the traction control. I cannot see any legitimate argument to this.

And as for your mistaken interpretation that my comment about you being new here had any negative connotation-what I was trying to state in a friendly and amusing manner was that because you are new you may not have had the opportunity yet to read through the forums and see how many crazy heated discussions have been stirred up with the argument about whether a manual or a DCT is better. It is like stirring up a tornado around here. So THAT is why people who have been here for some length of time vs a newbie may have some additional insights. That is all.

Man your little voice in the back of your head sure attaches ridiculous meaning to things.

Ok everybody simma da na. Coldlist I totally agree with everything you said, and I didn't think you sound snobbish. Everybody needs to understand that on this forum you have amateur guys, and you have guys are professionals. You also have guys that have owned many REAL sports cars so they are fortunate to have this personal experience to share with others. It behooves us to pay attention to that to form a conclusion that suits you. For me it's priceless to talk with some of you guys about your experiences and opinions. I'd prefer to have that over a salesmen or a Car & Driver article.

Bottomline, the M5 is amazing car in it's own class but I feel the M devision needs to reevaluate some things because I feel they are losing sight of the heritage.

[fortressmaximus]

Does the portion of the spoiler above the ducktail still go up at 75 mph with this aero kit?

[ColdList]

Originally Posted by Ftc120

I didn't mean to hurt your feelings or bruise your ego cold list. I actually wish I was younger. And as I said I think your Porsche is a beautiful car ! As far as me being old news ? You are by no means one to make that call my friend.

You don't actually have the ability to bruise my ego nor I am sure do I have the ability to bruise yours. Lets just call it a day amicably and move on. Deal?

[ColdList]

Originally Posted by fortressmaximus

Does the portion of the spoiler above the ducktail still go up at 75 mph with this aero kit?

Actually with the kit the spoiler is fixed. I do really like how that spoiler automatically goes up on cars without it though.

[fortressmaximus]

Originally Posted by ColdList

Actually with the kit the spoiler is fixed. I do really like how that spoiler automatically goes up on cars without it though.

Thank you

[ColdList]

Originally Posted by aculeg87

Ok everybody simma da na. Coldlist I totally agree with everything you said, and I didn't think you sound snobbish. Everybody needs to understand that on this forum you have amateur guys, and you have guys are professionals. You also have guys that have owned many REAL sports cars so they are fortunate to have this personal experience to share with others. It behooves us to pay attention to that to form a conclusion that suits you. For me it's priceless to talk with some of you guys about your experiences and opinions. I'd prefer to have that over a salesmen or a Car & Driver article.

Bottomline, the M5 is amazing car in it's own class but I feel the M devision needs to reevaluate some things because I feel they are losing sight of the heritage.

Thank you.

I agree wholeheartedly in regards to the M cars. That is why I still own one and LOVE it. I do wish there was more focus on sport. I guess BMW might be intending the M3/4 to be representative of those values and for the 5/6 to head up the GT category, which is fine as well and probably strategically necessary to compete with AMG and other manufacturers that have moved and/or are moving that direction. It is a different buyer than the M5/6 buyers of the pst and I suspect that many will either shift to the 3/4 or move to different brands altogether to get the sports car experience they desire.

[ColdList]

Originally Posted by Ftc120

Agreed. Again I apologize I did not mean to come across the wrong way in regards to the Porsche vs. m5 debate. I think cars can be a very subjective issue when it comes to what we like in different vehicles, espcially performance vehicles like these. I do respect your opinion and I apologize for the misunderstanding, I myself feel the current M5 is the best yet. Well, the e39 certainly may disagree with that.

All good. I truly love the M5 too. In fact, Henry and I were discussing yesterday that having both the P car and the M car in the garage actually makes you appreciate them both more for their respective characteristics. I was laughing with my wife last night about how impossible it is to say which one is more fun. I was talking about how I make excuses to runs out and grab pizza so I can drive them. The challenge In choosing which car to get in is that on one part of the route the P car is far more fun and on another part the M is way more fun! Ugh...

[Bimmer6]

Originally Posted by ColdList

All good. I truly love the M5 too. In fact, Henry and I were discussing yesterday that having both the P car and the M car in the garage actually makes you appreciate them both more for their respective characteristics. I was laughing with my wife last night about how impossible it is to say which one is more fun. I was talking about how I make excuses to runs out and grab pizza so I can drive them. The challenge In choosing which car to get in is that on one part of the route the P car is far more fun and on another part the M is way more fun! Ugh...

The difference is I kept my M5 and it drives the same as the M6(:

[Bimmer6]

Originally Posted by Ftc120

I envy you ! I wish I had that problem. They are both great cars ! I hope someday to own a Porsche, although there has always been something that has intrigued me about a four door sports sedan that can do the things a M 5 can do.

Welcome to the board we are all car freaks, and speed freaks to say the least regardless of brand. Ummmm but we lean towards BMW even though the M5 is the same poundage as the 2001 740(:

[ColdList]

Originally Posted by Bimmer6

The difference is I kept my M5 and it drives the same as the M6(:

You are NUTS man!-lol!

[ColdList]

Originally Posted by Bimmer6

Nice! Man do you sleep. You past me and I was a member last year(:

I'm an Overachiever!

[ColdList]

Originally Posted by Team Plutonium

Throw in some corners and I'd be gone, but on the straights I need a long breath to catch him.

Isn't that the truth!-lol! Probably the most perfect comparison one could make of these two cars.

P feels like you are in a race car all the time. M feels like you are in a rocket!

[ColdList]

Originally Posted by Ftc120

Thank you for the welcome. You are right the new M 5 weighs about as much as the 2001 740, but would you agree that it does not feel or handle like the 740 in any way ? At least I do not think it does. Again I feel for a 4300 lbs. four door sedan it handles like a much smaller car. When I say much smaller I am talking better than a E 39 M 5.

I would agree that it does handle very well "for it's weight" with "weight" remaining the factor that keeps us from simply saying that "it handles well". Uh oh...here we go again-lol!

[FLOMACKS]

Let's just all agree to go out and get 911's and put this whole thing behind us.

[Pazzo009]

This has turned into a dick measuring contest. It happens....

[FLOMACKS]

I'm serious. Let's go get 911's.

[ColdList]

Ok I will give you that!

[ColdList]

Originally Posted by Team Plutonium

My advantage will be the weight and traction. Especially with sticky 305's, KW's, engine sitting on it, and full exhaust.

His advantage is obviously the DCT and launch control (against my 7MT), and the gates of hell opening up at 1200 rpm (compared to me having to wait until 6K).

At this point I'm at around 450 hp crank, down around 100hp than him, but with much less weight to struggle with. On a track weight is everything, or the lack thereof, but on the road it hardly matters.

I don't know how much the DCT with launch helps though. It is not much "control". Mine spins incessantly where as on the 991 it simply grips and goes violently. Plus, by the time he recruits and engineer to sit in the passenger seat and operate the 12 step LC on the BMW you will already be off in the distance-lol!