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      10-30-2013, 04:46 PM   #1
ImpetuousRacer
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Agency Power Catted Downpipes

Why I personally chose to go with catted, because I wanted:
  • To pass emissions without having to swap downpipes
  • I didn't want to void warranty with a tune (if a solution does come out to rid the CEL)
  • Warranty on car with catted down pipes seems easier than no cat DP
  • I didn't want the added smell
  • The sound was a little less raspy and subdued compared to catless dp

When choosing a catted version, only 3 existed: AMS, Agency Power & SuperSprint

Stock image of the Agency Power uncoated catted downpipes for the F10 M5 from Vivid Racing.


I ordered a pair of these with high-temp coating from Vivid Racing. They use the same identical GESi catalytic converters as the AMS. However, their location for the secondary O2's are much closer to the stock location. The quality of the welds look to be good too, and the flex pipe appears to have a little more give than the AMS brackets. Their price point was better than AMS as well. Therefore I chose to go with these.

I'm in AZ, and will be having Vivid install these on 11/5/2013 and will give some more feedback after some miles.


I talked to James at Vivid Racing, phenomenal customer service, answered a plethora of questions I had (from quality to Vivid and AP's previous reputation in some instances), and he is a great guy. I recommend anyone to work with him on any items you need from Vivid Racing.


Last edited by ImpetuousRacer; 11-04-2013 at 04:58 PM.. Reason: Added SuperSprint
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      10-30-2013, 07:28 PM   #2
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Quote:
Originally Posted by ImpetuousRacer
Why I personally chose to go with catted, because I wanted:
  • To pass emissions without having to swap downpipes
  • I didn't want to void warranty with a tune (if a solution does come out to rid the CEL)
  • Warranty on car with catted down pipes seems easier than no cat DP
  • I didn't want the added smell
  • The sound was a little less raspy and subdued compared to catless dp

When choosing a catted version, only 2 existed. AMS & Agency Power

Stock image of the Agency Power uncoated catted downpipes for the F10 M5 from Vivid Racing.


I ordered a pair of these with high-temp coating from Vivid Racing. They use the same identical GESi catalytic converters as the AMS. However, their location for the secondary O2's are much closer to the stock location. The quality of the welds look to be good too, and the flex pipe appears to have a little more give than the AMS brackets. Their price point was better than AMS as well. Therefore I chose to go with these.

I'm in AZ, and will be having Vivid install these on Tuesday and will give some more feedback after some miles.


I talked to James at Vivid Racing, phenomenal customer service, answered a plethora of questions I had (from quality to Vivid and AP's previous reputation in some instances), and he is a great guy. I recommend anyone to work with him on any items you need from Vivid Racing.

Actually there are 3 . You forgot the Supersprint catted DP's with HJS 200 cell .
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      10-30-2013, 09:29 PM   #3
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Actually there are 3 . You forgot the Supersprint catted DP's with HJS 200 cell .
Thanks. Didn't know about those. Anyone getting a CEL with that being a 200 cell?
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      10-30-2013, 09:43 PM   #4
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      10-30-2013, 09:54 PM   #5
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Quote:
Originally Posted by ImpetuousRacer
Quote:
Originally Posted by gmd2003 View Post
Actually there are 3 . You forgot the Supersprint catted DP's with HJS 200 cell .
Thanks. Didn't know about those. Anyone getting a CEL with that being a 200 cell?
Given my knowledge of HJS cats on other cars and Supersprints claims, there will be no CEL . A 200 cell HJS cat is wayyyy more efficient than a moderate tier cat like what's in AMS's or AP's downpipes . HJS cats have tons more platinum in them that's why they cost so much , that's also why they are able to be emissions compliant while having fewer cells
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      10-31-2013, 11:02 AM   #6
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Quote:
Originally Posted by gmd2003 View Post
Given my knowledge of HJS cats on other cars and Supersprints claims, there will be no CEL . A 200 cell HJS cat is wayyyy more efficient than a moderate tier cat like what's in AMS's or AP's downpipes . HJS cats have tons more platinum in them that's why they cost so much , that's also why they are able to be emissions compliant while having fewer cells
Great info. The SS are about double the cost, not sure it equals double the results.
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      10-31-2013, 02:19 PM   #7
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Quote:
Originally Posted by ImpetuousRacer
Quote:
Originally Posted by gmd2003 View Post
Given my knowledge of HJS cats on other cars and Supersprints claims, there will be no CEL . A 200 cell HJS cat is wayyyy more efficient than a moderate tier cat like what's in AMS's or AP's downpipes . HJS cats have tons more platinum in them that's why they cost so much , that's also why they are able to be emissions compliant while having fewer cells
Great info. The SS are about double the cost, not sure it equals double the results.
1200 dollar difference shipped for me . AMS vs SS . Knowing I will have perfect OEM fitment , better flow, and will never have an HJS cat fail and be sucked into my engine ........ Priceless
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      10-31-2013, 04:27 PM   #8
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Quote:
Originally Posted by gmd2003 View Post
1200 dollar difference shipped for me . AMS vs SS . Knowing I will have perfect OEM fitment , better flow, and will never have an HJS cat fail and be sucked into my engine ........ Priceless
Well said. I'm envious of your choice.

Some pics of mine before install:




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      10-31-2013, 04:59 PM   #9
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Quote:
Originally Posted by ImpetuousRacer
Quote:
Originally Posted by gmd2003 View Post
1200 dollar difference shipped for me . AMS vs SS . Knowing I will have perfect OEM fitment , better flow, and will never have an HJS cat fail and be sucked into my engine ........ Priceless
Well said. I'm envious of your choice.

Some pics of mine before install:




Nice welds , and I like that the o2 bungs are closer to stock . Let me know how the install goes . Congrats !
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      10-31-2013, 07:45 PM   #10
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I hope he doesn't get a cel. Those look nice
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      11-01-2013, 12:38 AM   #11
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Quote:
Originally Posted by gmd2003 View Post
Nice welds , and I like that the o2 bungs are closer to stock . Let me know how the install goes . Congrats !
Thanks, will do!


Quote:
Originally Posted by boots View Post
I hope he doesn't get a cel. Those look nice
I dont see any reason I would? They are the same exact HFC that AMS uses and Vivid has tested them on a local 2013 M5 for over a month with zero CEL. I'll let you know if my experience is otherwise.

Last edited by ImpetuousRacer; 11-01-2013 at 12:46 AM..
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      11-01-2013, 06:27 AM   #12
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I say that because a couple of catted guys here reported receiving a cel.
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      11-01-2013, 08:19 AM   #13
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Quote:
Originally Posted by ImpetuousRacer
Quote:
Originally Posted by gmd2003 View Post
Nice welds , and I like that the o2 bungs are closer to stock . Let me know how the install goes . Congrats !
Thanks, will do!


Quote:
Originally Posted by boots View Post
I hope he doesn't get a cel. Those look nice
I dont see any reason I would? They are the same exact HFC that AMS uses and Vivid has tested them on a local 2013 M5 for over a month with zero CEL. I'll let you know if my experience is otherwise.
The 2014 US ECU seems to have a more stringent emissions setting for the secondary 02 sensors .
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      11-01-2013, 08:58 AM   #14
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Quote:
Originally Posted by ImpetuousRacer View Post
  • To pass emissions without having to swap downpipes
  • I didn't want to void warranty with a tune (if a solution does come out to rid the CEL)
  • Warranty on car with catted down pipes seems easier than no cat DP
  • I didn't want the added smell
  • The sound was a little less raspy and subdued compared to catless dp
Those downpipes look good. A few thoughts on the various downpipe construction approaches. I wonder if the flex portion would be of any advantage if the M5 was hit in a rear end collision? Possibly help isolate the turbos from impact stress? AMS obviously builds a quality product, BUT what were they thinking when they placed the secondary O2 bung so far from the stock location? Other builders have found it possible to put the bung at or near the stock location and avoid the cabling difficulties. Lastly, for those of you more in the know about how the engine reacts to the elimination of the cats, would the fuel smell many have mentioned be reduced or eliminated with a proper tune which is able to deal with no cats in the system? Oh, another last question, will the added (and expensive) platinum in the Supersprint DPs provide longer service life for those of us who keep our cars for quite a long time?
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      11-04-2013, 12:08 PM   #15
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Quote:
Originally Posted by ImpetuousRacer View Post
Thanks, will do!




I dont see any reason I would? They are the same exact HFC that AMS uses and Vivid has tested them on a local 2013 M5 for over a month with zero CEL. I'll let you know if my experience is otherwise.
Are the Agency Power cats 300 cell or 200 cell?
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      11-04-2013, 02:57 PM   #16
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Originally Posted by Tom C View Post
Are the Agency Power cats 300 cell or 200 cell?
From my understanding, they use identical part number GESi catalytic converters as the AMS use (300 cell).

From what I can read on the cat...
2000MUHO

N\GBL\4389\1307

Gesi Ultra High Output Catalytic Converter is all I can tell from those numbers.

Last edited by ImpetuousRacer; 11-04-2013 at 04:36 PM..
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      11-05-2013, 05:01 PM   #17
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No install today. Vivid took the engine cover off and found a coolant leak. Pretty much same as described in this thread: http://f10.m5post.com/forums/showpos...45&postcount=1

Bringing car into the dealer tomorrow to fix coolant leak,
Also, Parking Distance Control error came on today,
and fix B&O illumination.

Hopefully in coming weeks will have it installed.
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      11-05-2013, 08:11 PM   #18
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To answer you used2 be,
1.) the flex portion is designed to move slightly to take stress off the DP's. , a good OEM like mounting solution is another just as effective way of doing this .
2.) catalyzers remove burnt fuel and hydrocarbons from the exhaust , removing them will always make your car smell like fuel , no matter how it's tuned .
3.) yes high quality cats like the HJS in SS DP's will last longer. ( you get what you pay for)
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      11-06-2013, 10:04 AM   #19
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Quote:
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2.) catalyzers remove burnt fuel and hydrocarbons from the exhaust , removing them will always make your car smell like fuel , no matter how it's tuned .
Thanks for your reply and info. I drove cars long before catalytic converters were used and there was no inordinate fuel smell in those cars. With the much more exact control over the air/fuel mixture in the combustion chamber these days, I'd think a tune would alleviate the fuel smell even while improving horsepower numbers. Eliminating the cats without any compensation in the fueling portion of the programming probably throws off the ratios in a negative way, hence the occasional limp mode encountered by some? A proper tune would bring that into balance without the cats and take away the fuel smell. Perhaps those of you who have only experienced catalyzed exhaust are more sensitive to the fuel smell than us older types.

Last edited by Used2be; 11-06-2013 at 10:16 AM..
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      11-18-2013, 05:50 PM   #20
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I had these installed about 500 miles ago.

I had Vivid racing do the install. Vivid racing has installed downpipes on about 10 F10's, so I felt confident in their installer doing the job.

The exhaust and sound of the car is virtually the same with a slightly more aggressive note when at WOT. It's precisely what I was looking for. I didnt want the car to be super loud (Hence the RPI GTS and catted DP choices over RPI GTM setup). Regular driving is pleasant with a great aggressive sound when pushed.

Butt dyno definitely feels increase in the midrange power. No raspy sound, no check engine light, no fume smells.

I'm very happy with the purchase and customer service from James at Vivid was phenomenal.

One thing to note, Agency Power did not include new gaskets with the DP's like AMS does. After a lot of reading, I decided to purchase new gaskets myself (Only $30 or so) and had them use during the install.
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