M5POST
BMW Garage BMW Meets Register Search Today's Posts Mark Forums Read

Go Back   M5POST - BMW M5 Forum > F10 M5 Forum > BMW M5 (F10) General Forum

Post Reply
 
Thread Tools Search this Thread
      12-03-2016, 09:31 PM   #1
TrevorM3
Banned
3318
Rep
8,083
Posts

Drives: 6.3 AMG
Join Date: Apr 2013
Location: Florida

iTrader: (0)

Tuned cars, come in..

http://f80.bimmerpost.com/forums/sho....php?t=1327330


Fortunately, i ran across this on the M3 side.


Start at page 3.


Basically, what is being implied is, (with a flashed ECU) anytime that car is now plugged into a BMW OBD, it's picking it up as a change and in turn telling the tech to consult BMW regarding repairs. And we can all infer where that is going to go...

Is this true? I have consulted two techs, one saying yes, the other saying NO. The latter, said he plugged in a jb4 m4 on friday, and didn't get any such prompt. Maybe this "update" or new software hasn't taken full effect yet, but it's something to definitely keep an eye on. This news just broke last week, and i know alot of people are shitting bricks, but we should definitely wait and see for a few weeks how things progress. The tech that told me this is true, said he didn't even have much info on it.


P.S

Regarding all the guys running piggies, supposedly this is a * better option in terms of needing warranty work (if you don't want to do a full flash) but as i always say, if BMW needs to find something, they will.
Appreciate 0
      12-03-2016, 10:45 PM   #2
Lerxst M4
Command Sergeant Major of the Army
Lerxst M4's Avatar
United_States
141
Rep
639
Posts

Drives: F82 M4
Join Date: Mar 2012
Location: Tejas

iTrader: (4)

Interesting....
__________________
2018 F82 M4 ZCP
2015 F13 M6 ZCP (gone)
2013 F10 M5 (gone)
2008 E90 M3 (gone)
Appreciate 0
      12-04-2016, 12:31 AM   #3
desertfox73
Banned
676
Rep
1,020
Posts

Drives: 2018 F83 / 2018 F85
Join Date: Jun 2011
Location: Nashville, Tennessee

iTrader: (0)

That's big news...very curious about the lease question and the possible inability to get a lease return car CPO'd. Surely BMW would levy a $$ penalty against that owner...
Appreciate 0
      12-04-2016, 12:36 AM   #4
RPiM5
Major General
RPiM5's Avatar
2856
Rep
7,883
Posts

Drives: Mexico Blue F10 M5(Mika)
Join Date: Apr 2012
Location: Sunny San Diego

iTrader: (0)

Lots of hearsay and very unsubstantiated. I've got 3 friends who are master technicians at BMW and they've never heard anything about this.
__________________


Appreciate 0
      12-04-2016, 12:52 AM   #5
sdshah
Banned
United_States
849
Rep
1,386
Posts

Drives: F85 | Panamera GTS
Join Date: Jul 2011
Location: USA

iTrader: (2)

BMW should be more worried about MB and Audi making better cars then +- 10,000 fanboys tuning their cars.
Appreciate 0
      12-04-2016, 01:49 AM   #6
Igor_M5
Igor_M5's Avatar
United_States
2128
Rep
1,830
Posts

Drives: Many, BMW.
Join Date: Aug 2007
Location: New York City

iTrader: (10)

Garage List
As of last week all BMW service center are running on a new system that is online 100% of the time - aka your info gets submitted directly to NA as soon as the car enters the shop floor and hooked up. Where as in the past, the hub was located directly in the dealership, where the tech's had the option to diag. scan your vehicle offline before submitting the data to NA for warranty approval.

Those confident in their tuners have nothing to worry about, in terms of the system picking up the unlock patch... I hope. I mean I know there were careless tuners doing improper patches in the past, so if their new system is actually able to spot the properly performed patches, oh man we're in for some shit.

Patches & system scans aside, those with drilled DME's (every tuned S63tu), we're all fucked. Word on the street is that on top of all this shit, recently NA sent out notices to dealers, informing service departments to keep an eye out for drilled DME's on V8TT models that are in for warranty / service and report them. So if your SA couldn't give two fucks about who you are, and if you happened to have a catastrophic failure, or something drivetrain related fails on you, I heard this will might help, group buy anyone?

So yeah... fun news. Anyone doubting the legitimacy of this new approach BMW is taking, I highly recommend you check back with your sources.

Last edited by Igor_M5; 12-04-2016 at 02:52 AM..
Appreciate 2
      12-04-2016, 06:26 AM   #7
TrevorM3
Banned
3318
Rep
8,083
Posts

Drives: 6.3 AMG
Join Date: Apr 2013
Location: Florida

iTrader: (0)

one good question asked in the thread was about flash counters. People with flashes can always revert back to stock.. but will it show everytime, will it then be flagged, can this e turned off etc..? i'm hoping a tuner can chime in.


I'm fully OK with the fact that if/when i decide to flash the car and the motor blows, i'd have to foot the bill. What i'm not ok with is having a flash, having a small problem, flashing BACK to stock and then having BMW give me shit about it.

sdshah, i dont think BMW is worried in the long run. Sure, the mod game is much bigger on our side, but what really needs to happen is one of these manufacturers needs to come out with their own tune that isn't raping everyone asshole like Dinan for an extra 40hp. If and when that day comes, i'm on board with them. As of right now, this is one hell of a predicament.
Appreciate 0
      12-04-2016, 06:42 AM   #8
Lerxst M4
Command Sergeant Major of the Army
Lerxst M4's Avatar
United_States
141
Rep
639
Posts

Drives: F82 M4
Join Date: Mar 2012
Location: Tejas

iTrader: (4)

BPMSport Mike, what say you?
__________________
2018 F82 M4 ZCP
2015 F13 M6 ZCP (gone)
2013 F10 M5 (gone)
2008 E90 M3 (gone)
Appreciate 0
      12-04-2016, 09:30 AM   #9
josec70
Major General
josec70's Avatar
United_States
4051
Rep
5,228
Posts

Drives: 22' Individual Chalk M5C
Join Date: Dec 2015
Location: Miami

iTrader: (2)

My SA confirmed this to be factual as well as the Notice for drilled DME's. This is not unlike what Audi started doing several years back with "Spec-Actuals" being delivered online to Audi NA although my Audi tune (APR) was via OBD Port so reverting to stock was relatively easy.

Never had any issues but then again I never had any major claims; no issues on lease return either.

Price to pay to play the game ...
__________________
CURRENT: 22' INDIVIDUAL M5| CHALK | TARTUFO | CCB | MPE | H&R | IND
GONE: 19' M5C| SINGAPORE GREY| ARAGON|VELOS VLS-06|H&R|iPE|IND|XPEL|CF|RADENSO
GONE: 15' F10 M5|BSM|BLACK|VELOS VSS-S2|KW|AKRA|IND|CF |ESCORT 360|VELOS PIGGY
GONE: 13' F10 M5|SG|BLACK|AKRA|KW|IND
LONG GONE: 09' E60 M5|02' E39 M5
Appreciate 0
      12-04-2016, 12:26 PM   #10
Eddybro
Captain
Eddybro's Avatar
553
Rep
822
Posts

Drives: Melbourne e90 and SG e92
Join Date: Jan 2014
Location: Austin, TX

iTrader: (0)

Two things I have to say about this whole thing...

1. BMW is going to lose a lot of customers gradually if this is true, once news gets out. The overall experience of owning an "M" car is the first factor contributing towards purchasing these cars. Secondly, at least for myself, the platform of twin turbos and the ability to make power easy, was the second factor.

BMWs biggest marketers are the people who drive their M cars. There is no better form of marketing than listening to an "M" car owner talk about their car, and relaying their experience to another driver. Now imaging sucking the life out of all of these enthusiastic owners around the world.. and replacing them with negative comments..

2. BMW should have at least informed owners or press released this information. This is a huge change when it comes to how customer information is transmitted and stored. Locally state side vs Information being transmitted overseas. I'm not specifically versed in the legal aspects of this. However, I was under the impression that companies in the US need consent to transmit data like this overseas, at least from the owner of the data.

__________________
Previous - '11 E90 M3 6MT Stripper Full Cloth
Current- GT3RS,MR e90 and SG E92 Comp
Appreciate 0
      12-04-2016, 02:17 PM   #11
Igor_M5
Igor_M5's Avatar
United_States
2128
Rep
1,830
Posts

Drives: Many, BMW.
Join Date: Aug 2007
Location: New York City

iTrader: (10)

Garage List
Quote:
Originally Posted by Eddybro View Post

2. BMW should have at least informed owners or press released this information. This is a huge change when it comes to how customer information is transmitted and stored. Locally state side vs Information being transmitted overseas. I'm not specifically versed in the legal aspects of this. However, I was under the impression that companies in the US need consent to transmit data like this overseas, at least from the owner of the data.

That is why BMW NA exists.

Conveniently located in NJ, where the largest population of tuned M5/M6's happens to reside.
Appreciate 0
      12-04-2016, 02:34 PM   #12
Redrckt135
Major
Redrckt135's Avatar
United_States
430
Rep
1,108
Posts

Drives: 16 M5 & 17 X5M
Join Date: May 2012
Location: Nj

iTrader: (10)

What...the...shit
Appreciate 0
      12-04-2016, 03:38 PM   #13
Eddybro
Captain
Eddybro's Avatar
553
Rep
822
Posts

Drives: Melbourne e90 and SG e92
Join Date: Jan 2014
Location: Austin, TX

iTrader: (0)

Quote:
Originally Posted by Igor_M5
Quote:
Originally Posted by Eddybro View Post

2. BMW should have at least informed owners or press released this information. This is a huge change when it comes to how customer information is transmitted and stored. Locally state side vs Information being transmitted overseas. I'm not specifically versed in the legal aspects of this. However, I was under the impression that companies in the US need consent to transmit data like this overseas, at least from the owner of the data.

That is why BMW NA exists.

Conveniently located in NJ, where the largest population of tuned M5/M6's happens to reside.
That maybe the case, however from what I have seen, companies are typically required to inform end users on how data captured is being used or monitored and for what purposes. Typically in an end user agreement or privacy statement.

Any attorneys familiar with these issues want to provide feedback?..
__________________
Previous - '11 E90 M3 6MT Stripper Full Cloth
Current- GT3RS,MR e90 and SG E92 Comp
Appreciate 0
      12-04-2016, 04:08 PM   #14
rambino
M Master
rambino's Avatar
United_States
74
Rep
551
Posts

Drives: M6 / X6M
Join Date: Jun 2007
Location: SoCal / Florida

iTrader: (3)

I think everyones freaking out over nothing.. They are making these new rules to cover their asses legally from abuse warranty claims, like overboosted blown engines, fully blown transmissions etc.. Dealerships arent going to be outting people all of a sudden when you come in for service or claims that are unrelated. They prob wont even screw you if it is related in a minor way like a blown diff. Remember when Nissan said if you mod the GTR your done... never happened except it gave them legal grounds if people were over abusing their warranties and cars. Having a good relationship with your service adviser is key..
__________________
M History: E46 M3, E92 M3, E63 M6, F13 M6 Comp Pkg, E71 X6M

Last edited by rambino; 12-04-2016 at 04:22 PM..
Appreciate 1
      12-04-2016, 05:43 PM   #15
Redrckt135
Major
Redrckt135's Avatar
United_States
430
Rep
1,108
Posts

Drives: 16 M5 & 17 X5M
Join Date: May 2012
Location: Nj

iTrader: (10)

Quote:
Originally Posted by rambino View Post
I think everyones freaking out over nothing.. They are making these new rules to cover their asses legally from abuse warranty claims, like overboosted blown engines, fully blown transmissions etc.. Dealerships arent going to be outting people all of a sudden when you come in for service or claims that are unrelated. They prob wont even screw you if it is related in a minor way like a blown diff. Remember when Nissan said if you mod the GTR your done... never happened except it gave them legal grounds if people were over abusing their warranties and cars. Having a good relationship with your service adviser is key..
^ this. Well said good sir.
Appreciate 0
      12-04-2016, 07:12 PM   #16
m5 guy
Brigadier General
m5 guy's Avatar
United_States
1662
Rep
3,198
Posts

Drives: 2020 M5 Comp
Join Date: Apr 2012
Location: Hawaii

iTrader: (14)

That's the thing though if I'm understanding it correctly. It has nothing to do with the dealer. It's an update on the software tools they use. As in the car comes in, they plug the car in like normal, and off the data goes. I don't think they will be able to 'hide' anything anymore. Not like before where they had the option to send the data.
__________________
2020 F90 M5 Comp Oxford Green Metallic II-Aragon JOURNAL
2016 F10 M5 Space Gray-Black SOLD
2012 E70 X5M Monte Carlo Blue-Silverstone SOLD
2001 E46 M3 Oxford Green Metallic II-Cinnamon SOLD
Appreciate 0
      12-04-2016, 07:17 PM   #17
TrevorM3
Banned
3318
Rep
8,083
Posts

Drives: 6.3 AMG
Join Date: Apr 2013
Location: Florida

iTrader: (0)

Quote:
Originally Posted by m5 guy View Post
That's the thing though if I'm understanding it correctly. It has nothing to do with the dealer. It's an update on the software tools they use. As in the car comes in, they plug the car in like normal, and off the data goes. I don't think they will be able to 'hide' anything anymore. Not like before where they had the option to send the data.


this is how i'm interpreting it as well.

As soon as the car gets plugged in, BMW NA has the cars info.

That is a major problem. But, let's see how it progresses throughout the next few weeks.


To clarify, no one was ever really able to "hide" anything. There is no hiding.
In a major failure, bmw will do their research.
Appreciate 0
      12-04-2016, 07:23 PM   #18
m5 guy
Brigadier General
m5 guy's Avatar
United_States
1662
Rep
3,198
Posts

Drives: 2020 M5 Comp
Join Date: Apr 2012
Location: Hawaii

iTrader: (14)

Quote:
Originally Posted by TrevorM3 View Post
Quote:
Originally Posted by m5 guy View Post
That's the thing though if I'm understanding it correctly. It has nothing to do with the dealer. It's an update on the software tools they use. As in the car comes in, they plug the car in like normal, and off the data goes. I don't think they will be able to 'hide' anything anymore. Not like before where they had the option to send the data.


this is how i'm interpreting it as well.

As soon as the car gets plugged in, BMW NA has the cars info.

That is a major problem. But, let's see how it progresses throughout the next few weeks.


To clarify, no one was ever really able to "hide" anything. There is no hiding.
In a major failure, bmw will do their research.
Correct. BMW could always tell if they needed to. Now though it seems like they get the info automatically without needing a reason.

So for me it looks like I'll most likely be doing my power adders in two stages. Dinan stage 2, intake, and mufflers for the warranty duration. Then post warranty if I still have the car BPM stage 2, catless downpipes, clutches, pure, etc.
__________________
2020 F90 M5 Comp Oxford Green Metallic II-Aragon JOURNAL
2016 F10 M5 Space Gray-Black SOLD
2012 E70 X5M Monte Carlo Blue-Silverstone SOLD
2001 E46 M3 Oxford Green Metallic II-Cinnamon SOLD
Appreciate 0
      12-04-2016, 08:21 PM   #19
MCarsFan
Lieutenant Colonel
MCarsFan's Avatar
United_States
363
Rep
1,805
Posts

Drives: 2014 BMW M5 F10 CP
Join Date: Apr 2013
Location: Dallas, Texas

iTrader: (0)

Garage List
2014 BMW F10 M5  [10.00]
Holy smokes! Run for the hills!
__________________
2014 BMW F10 M5 ZCP | SSII / Black | MSR Stage III | MSR Intakes | RPi GTM Exhaust | RPi Catless Downpipes |RW Carbon Front Lip | RW Carbon Diffuser | RW Carbon Trunk Spoiler |
Appreciate 0
      12-04-2016, 08:26 PM   #20
Jhenka
Private First Class
Jhenka's Avatar
United_States
31
Rep
191
Posts

Drives: 2015 M5
Join Date: Apr 2012
Location: New York

iTrader: (2)

Garage List
2015 BMW M5  [0.00]
So with all that being said, how will this new update effect the people with JB4 tunes (not full flashes). I've heard people in the past would just set it to map 0 and unplug the OBDII hookup. Is that still the case or will the tunes need to be removed altogether?
Taking the tune out of my 550 was a joke ~5 mins, taking out the tune from the m5 with all the ports and the BCM is going to be a nightmare.
Appreciate 0
      12-05-2016, 12:40 AM   #21
allmotor_2000
F10 1/4 WR: 9.9s / 142.5mph 1/2 WR: 175.5mph
1083
Rep
1,968
Posts

Drives: 2018 RS3, 991 Turbo
Join Date: Jul 2014
Location: Westlake Village, CA

iTrader: (0)

It's a fact that the information goes to BMW directly. I haven't tested the 'anti tamper' patch but it's not worth the risk. Anyways even when my trans blew I bought a used one - I mean it wasn't designed for 1000ft-lbs of torque so it is unethical to have BMW replace it.

Same goes for the engine - people have blown 30-40 motors and taken it back. BMW is obviously aware as it's an expensive RMA especially with NA labor rates.

The S63tu is a strong motor when maintained and tuned properly. I have pushed 800-1000hp for 75% of the 30K miles I have on the car. Runs like a champ. Most of the people who have blown their engines don't know what they are doing... sorry!! I can imagine this motor (mine included) getting weaker over time but for it to actually blow-up, it has to be user error or some component failed under load (injector etc.).

My $0.02 if you want to keep the car and not just turn it into Carmax and screw the next guy... is plan on getting a spare engine. Think about it.... what's the price of a 700-800hp car? Here we have a 4-door sedan that can easily push 750hp reliably.
Appreciate 1
      12-05-2016, 06:15 AM   #22
josec70
Major General
josec70's Avatar
United_States
4051
Rep
5,228
Posts

Drives: 22' Individual Chalk M5C
Join Date: Dec 2015
Location: Miami

iTrader: (2)

Quote:
Originally Posted by allmotor_2000 View Post
It's a fact that the information goes to BMW directly. I haven't tested the 'anti tamper' patch but it's not worth the risk. Anyways even when my trans blew I bought a used one - I mean it wasn't designed for 1000ft-lbs of torque so it is unethical to have BMW replace it.

Same goes for the engine - people have blown 30-40 motors and taken it back. BMW is obviously aware as it's an expensive RMA especially with NA labor rates.

The S63tu is a strong motor when maintained and tuned properly. I have pushed 800-1000hp for 75% of the 30K miles I have on the car. Runs like a champ. Most of the people who have blown their engines don't know what they are doing... sorry!! I can imagine this motor (mine included) getting weaker over time but for it to actually blow-up, it has to be user error or some component failed under load (injector etc.).

My $0.02 if you want to keep the car and not just turn it into Carmax and screw the next guy... is plan on getting a spare engine. Think about it.... what's the price of a 700-800hp car? Here we have a 4-door sedan that can easily push 750hp reliably.

Agree 100% ... PRICE to play the game.
__________________
CURRENT: 22' INDIVIDUAL M5| CHALK | TARTUFO | CCB | MPE | H&R | IND
GONE: 19' M5C| SINGAPORE GREY| ARAGON|VELOS VLS-06|H&R|iPE|IND|XPEL|CF|RADENSO
GONE: 15' F10 M5|BSM|BLACK|VELOS VSS-S2|KW|AKRA|IND|CF |ESCORT 360|VELOS PIGGY
GONE: 13' F10 M5|SG|BLACK|AKRA|KW|IND
LONG GONE: 09' E60 M5|02' E39 M5
Appreciate 0
Post Reply

Bookmarks

Thread Tools Search this Thread
Search this Thread:

Advanced Search

Posting Rules
You may not post new threads
You may not post replies
You may not post attachments
You may not edit your posts

BB code is On
Smilies are On
[IMG] code is On
HTML code is Off



All times are GMT -5. The time now is 07:45 AM.




m5post
Powered by vBulletin® Version 3.8.11
Copyright ©2000 - 2024, vBulletin Solutions Inc.
1Addicts.com, BIMMERPOST.com, E90Post.com, F30Post.com, M3Post.com, ZPost.com, 5Post.com, 6Post.com, 7Post.com, XBimmers.com logo and trademark are properties of BIMMERPOST