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      12-23-2015, 10:51 PM   #23
Bluehorseshoe
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You're absolutely right Stealth. I think that I paid $110k for the car new, and if I were to sell it privately for say $80k that would not be extreme depreciation. I have just never had the patience to deal with private party sales. For future reference what's the best way to list? eBay Motors, Auto Trader or some other way or all of the above?
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      12-24-2015, 11:57 AM   #24
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Bluehorseshoe View Post
You're absolutely right Stealth. I think that I paid $110k for the car new, and if I were to sell it privately for say $80k that would not be extreme depreciation. I have just never had the patience to deal with private party sales. For future reference what's the best way to list? eBay Motors, Auto Trader or some other way or all of the above?
Personally I think 80 is still pretty S* especially for your milage. Maybe not with 20k+ miles but for 5k miles

Ebay is pretty easy to list on, never done a car. Cars.com is easy to list on too...

Personally I'd also try some of the bigger forums like e90post, bimmerfest that get a lot of traffic in the cars for sale threads... Maybe you'll bump into someone looking to step up.
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      12-24-2015, 02:37 PM   #25
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Just traded the car in for 90k. Carmax offered 75k. Car was a 16 with 1800 miles on it. M cars and AMGs can not hold value.
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      12-24-2015, 05:13 PM   #26
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Quote:
Originally Posted by superbad View Post
Just traded the car in for 90k. Carmax offered 75k. Car was a 16 with 1800 miles on it. M cars and AMGs can not hold value.
Thats not bad, I was trying to trade my 14 in with 3600 on a GTR for 86k
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      12-29-2015, 02:45 PM   #27
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this is what i got

I'm new here and wanted the community help. you guys are really great!!

i got this offer on 2015 M5. is it any good?

Sticker price: $124,900 (car is loaded with almost everything)
Selling price: $106,900
Cap reduction: $2,634
term: 36 months
MF: 0.00131
Residual: .59 (this is 2015 model)
down payment: $5,000 (includes fees, tax, first month and the additional cap reduction)

MONTHLY PAYMENT: $1,100 (tax included)

can i do better? PLEASE HELP!!!
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      12-29-2015, 03:36 PM   #28
M5Rlz
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Quote:
Originally Posted by dgabay View Post
I'm new here and wanted the community help. you guys are really great!!

i got this offer on 2015 M5. is it any good?

Sticker price: $124,900 (car is loaded with almost everything)
Selling price: $106,900
Cap reduction: $2,634
term: 36 months
MF: 0.00131
Residual: .59 (this is 2015 model)
down payment: $5,000 (includes fees, tax, first month and the additional cap reduction)

MONTHLY PAYMENT: $1,100 (tax included)

can i do better? PLEASE HELP!!!
I feel like you have a tad more wiggle room considering they want to move cars before end of the year, but I wouldn't say its bad or amazing, kinda expected.
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      01-09-2016, 04:09 PM   #29
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Hey what dealer did you use?
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      01-15-2016, 09:47 PM   #30
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Do we have any lease gurus here that would be able to explain the ins and the outs of money factor and residual relation?
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      01-16-2016, 10:15 AM   #31
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Quote:
Originally Posted by greentrbo95gst View Post
Do we have any lease gurus here that would be able to explain the ins and the outs of money factor and residual relation?
Technically they are not related...


MF (Money Factor) is basically the interest equivalent for a lease. You can take the factor and multiply it by 24 to get a raw APR factor. EG: .00131 x 24 is .03144. Move the decimal over 2 and you get 3.14%. So a lease with .00131 has about a 3.14% interest equivalent built into each payment.

The residual is manufacturers estimated value at the end of the lease term based on years and mileage allowed. Its a percentage of the msrp of the car. So a 60% residual based 10k miles a year for 3 years(example only) on a 100k msrp car is 60,000. This is the buyout amount at the end of your term and the value used to determine the amount of depreciation one pays during the term. Lets say on that 100k msrp car, the agreed upon price is 100k and the term is 3 years at 10k miles per year. The 60% factor is used and the 100k agreed upon price minus the 60,000 divided by the term (36 months) gets you the depreciation payment.

You then have to add in the interest equivalent monies to the depreciation payment plus any applicable monthly sales taxes. Some states are called "up front states" and the taxes are due up front based on the price of the car. To get this you take the agreed upon value of the car (aka Net Cap Cost) and add the residual to it, take that value and multiply against the MF to get the lease service charge. On the above example, the 100k is agreed upon and the residual is 60k so you take 160000 x .00131 and you get a service charge (monthly) of 209.60. Add this to your depreciation amount and you get the base payment in the lease.

Taxes, Cap Cost reduction, state laws, all play a factor in monies owed up front so I just did a basic example. The residual is set by bank and the MF is credit dependent (tiers set by the banks) and subject to dealer markup (aka reserve). The dealer could get an approval from the bank for a .00131 money factory with the ability to mark it up 1 pt for interest profit paid up front at the time of the lease funding. This could effective make the customers MF .00231 or 5.54% vs the 3.14% that was equal to .00131. This money differential is the advanced to dealer up front via a split (usually 70%). This is all part of the internals but I can easily tell if someone is getting marked up if I have the residual, term, net cap, and base payment.
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Last edited by Vic55; 01-16-2016 at 10:26 AM..
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      01-16-2016, 11:54 AM   #32
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Quote:
Originally Posted by greentrbo95gst View Post
Do we have any lease gurus here that would be able to explain the ins and the outs of money factor and residual relation?
You may need to read this thread:
http://f80.bimmerpost.com/forums/sho....php?t=1084623
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      01-18-2016, 06:38 AM   #33
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some of you sound very surprised that such a high dollar car depreciates so badly. which is surprising.......
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      01-19-2016, 10:09 AM   #34
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Vic55 View Post
Technically they are not related...


MF (Money Factor) is basically the interest equivalent for a lease. You can take the factor and multiply it by 24 to get a raw APR factor. EG: .00131 x 24 is .03144. Move the decimal over 2 and you get 3.14%. So a lease with .00131 has about a 3.14% interest equivalent built into each payment.

The residual is manufacturers estimated value at the end of the lease term based on years and mileage allowed. Its a percentage of the msrp of the car. So a 60% residual based 10k miles a year for 3 years(example only) on a 100k msrp car is 60,000. This is the buyout amount at the end of your term and the value used to determine the amount of depreciation one pays during the term. Lets say on that 100k msrp car, the agreed upon price is 100k and the term is 3 years at 10k miles per year. The 60% factor is used and the 100k agreed upon price minus the 60,000 divided by the term (36 months) gets you the depreciation payment.

You then have to add in the interest equivalent monies to the depreciation payment plus any applicable monthly sales taxes. Some states are called "up front states" and the taxes are due up front based on the price of the car. To get this you take the agreed upon value of the car (aka Net Cap Cost) and add the residual to it, take that value and multiply against the MF to get the lease service charge. On the above example, the 100k is agreed upon and the residual is 60k so you take 160000 x .00131 and you get a service charge (monthly) of 209.60. Add this to your depreciation amount and you get the base payment in the lease.

Taxes, Cap Cost reduction, state laws, all play a factor in monies owed up front so I just did a basic example. The residual is set by bank and the MF is credit dependent (tiers set by the banks) and subject to dealer markup (aka reserve). The dealer could get an approval from the bank for a .00131 money factory with the ability to mark it up 1 pt for interest profit paid up front at the time of the lease funding. This could effective make the customers MF .00231 or 5.54% vs the 3.14% that was equal to .00131. This money differential is the advanced to dealer up front via a split (usually 70%). This is all part of the internals but I can easily tell if someone is getting marked up if I have the residual, term, net cap, and base payment.
Quote:
Originally Posted by M6-Coupe View Post


Awesome. Thanks
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      01-23-2016, 03:24 PM   #35
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Quote:
Originally Posted by TrevorM3 View Post
some of you sound very surprised that such a high dollar car depreciates so badly. which is surprising.......
GTR didn't up until 2015 ask Vic about what he sold his for

I don't think anyones shocked. But its closing in on 30% after 1 year is pretty bad.



If you're driving an AMG I'm guessing your'e beyond used to extreme depreciation lololol
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      01-23-2016, 06:12 PM   #36
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Quote:
Originally Posted by 335iRlz View Post
GTR didn't up until 2015 ask Vic about what he sold his for

I don't think anyones shocked. But its closing in on 30% after 1 year is pretty bad.



If you're driving an AMG I'm guessing your'e beyond used to extreme depreciation lololol


i buy used. lol 2 years old is the sweet spot for these kinds of cars.
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      01-23-2016, 08:11 PM   #37
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Quote:
Originally Posted by TrevorM3 View Post
i buy used. lol 2 years old is the sweet spot for these kinds of cars.
Smartest comment in here lol


I'd have a billet block for the GTR with what I lost between the M5 and M4 lmao... Oh well such is life haha
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      03-07-2016, 11:48 AM   #38
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Bimmer6 View Post
Damn, my 2013 ED with discounts was 93k and I got 60k for my 2013 with 14k miles on it. Think they low balled you big time. ED is the best to buy this cars! BMW is the only dealer I know of the does ED discounts .........Porsche laughed when I asked ..........well I knew the answer.
Whats the discount rate on ED? Correct me if Im wrong but doesnt that pretty much equal a standard stateside delivery after factoring in the flight for 2, hotels stay and European tour?
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      03-07-2016, 06:46 PM   #39
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If I can recall for the M5 its 7% off MSRP, and my dealer gave me another 3k off that. I took delivery in 2012 when most were paying over MSRP. The ED prices are listed per vehicle. Google BMW ED prices it should come up. Oh yeah my car was late due to the oil pump recall and BMW sent me a check for 3k ...so my car ended up being negative invoice. I go to Europe for work so I did a long weekend which was perfect for me.
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      03-08-2016, 02:21 PM   #40
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MSRP 118,595
selling price 108,748
60% Residual
.00135
total due includes tax title first payment etc. 6350
plus 2000 rebates/credits
1228 payment
ordered car

Last edited by Greenwillie; 03-09-2016 at 09:47 AM..
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      03-08-2016, 06:58 PM   #41
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Greenwillie View Post
MSRP 118,595
selling price 108,748
60% Residual
.00135
ordered car



monthly payments? money down?
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      03-12-2016, 12:34 PM   #42
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Greenwillie
MSRP 118,595
selling price 108,748
60% Residual
.00135
total due includes tax title first payment etc. 6350
plus 2000 rebates/credits
1228 payment
ordered car
Not bad but I wouldn't pay all the taxes upfront I would roll into payment.. I'm looking for similar car right now almost same msrp but they want high 1300's I'm not sure if that's because I'm in NYC
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