Purpose of side markers located on mirrors?

hinckley · 08-06-2013, 12:37 PM

I've lived, worked and traveled to Europe on and off over the past 30+ years, and as life-long motorhead, I was always interested in the differences between American and European cars.

Way back when, the side markers on European cars were always on the front fenders. I always figured that they were placed there to notify other cars that were approaching from the side - for example, if you were being overtaken or if you were pulling out of a parking space. In those instances, the front and rear direction signals are not always visible. So for that reason, the side markers on the fenders were very smart to me.

But now all the side markers are being moved to the mirrors, I believe in accordance with new European legal requirements, and I'm confused. Located on the mirrors, the markers are now mainly visible to cars approaching head on, just like the markers in the front of the car. So to me, the purpose is duplicative and their side functionality is lost.

But I'm sure that the brains of Brussels had something else in mind. What am I missing?

Netwon · 08-07-2013, 09:57 AM

Shhhhh!!! Don't encourage the EU for anymore regulations!!!!! Our quiet M5 exhausts are proof of that!!!

JOHNBMWM5 · 08-07-2013, 10:44 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by hinckley

But I'm sure that the brains of Brussels had something else in mind. What am I missing?

Because we do NOT have the god awful markers in the front wings, they look sooooo NAF.

24601 · 08-07-2013, 12:45 PM

Good point. This should not have been changed from fender to mirror.

It just makes it worse. From the 3/4 rear angle you can see a fender blinker, not on a mirror, nor can you see it dead on, if I'm correct.

Stupid Americans.

JOHNBMWM5 · 08-07-2013, 12:49 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by MY13E92M3

Good point. This should not have been changed from fender to mirror.

It just makes it worse. From the 3/4 rear angle you can see a fender blinker, not on a mirror, nor can you see it dead on, if I'm correct.

Stupid Americans.

I have not seen my LCI M5 yet so not sure IF the mirrors incorporate the Indicators , I personally hope they do, as I like to see them working.
Anyone confirm this one way or the other?.

24601 · 08-07-2013, 12:59 PM

Looking on bmwusa.com, BYO M5, looks like it will remain on the fender. You lucky guy!

Boss330 · 08-07-2013, 01:47 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by hinckley

I've lived, worked and traveled to Europe on and off over the past 30+ years, and as life-long motorhead, I was always interested in the differences between American and European cars.

Way back when, the side markers on European cars were always on the front fenders. I always figured that they were placed there to notify other cars that were approaching from the side - for example, if you were being overtaken or if you were pulling out of a parking space. In those instances, the front and rear direction signals are not always visible. So for that reason, the side markers on the fenders were very smart to me.

But now all the side markers are being moved to the mirrors, I believe in accordance with new European legal requirements, and I'm confused. Located on the mirrors, the markers are now mainly visible to cars approaching head on, just like the markers in the front of the car. So to me, the purpose is duplicative and their side functionality is lost.

But I'm sure that the brains of Brussels had something else in mind. What am I missing?

See page 19 of this document (ECE Reg 06 covering direction markers):

http://www.unece.org/fileadmin/DAM/t...gs/R006r5e.pdf

This is the legislation in force within the EU, as referred to in Annex II to EU directive 76/759/EEC

As you can see on page 19, the idea of these direction markers is to be visible from the rear. So even though manufacturers also choose to make them visible from the front (with the largest illuminated area towards the front), they still have to comply with ECE Reg 6 regarding visibilty from the rear.

stealth.pilot · 08-07-2013, 02:01 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Netwon

Shhhhh!!! Don't encourage the EU for anymore regulations!!!!! Our quiet M5 exhausts are proof of that!!!

That's BMW not EU regs. Jaguar had no difficulty designing a jaw dropping exhaust sound into the F-Type.

Boss330 · 08-07-2013, 02:06 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by stealth.pilot

That's BMW not EU regs. Jaguar had no difficulty designing a jaw dropping exhaust sound into the F-Type.

The EU regs have a specific noise test procedure with certain gears, revs, accelerations etc. Make your car comply with those exact provisions, and use valves in the exhaust, it's legal to make all the noise you want outside the test criterias... (within reasonable levels off course

)

hinckley · 08-07-2013, 02:15 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Boss330

As you can see on page 19, the idea of these direction markers is to be visible from the rear. So even though manufacturers also choose to make them visible from the front (with the largest illuminated area towards the front), they still have to comply with ECE Reg 6 regarding visibilty from the rear.

Yikes! Glad it's you reading this stuff and not me. But I still don't understand the change of position. It seems to me that the markers located on the fenders are better seen from the rear than the very small area of light emitted to the rear from the mirror-mounted markers.

I hadn't thought so, but maybe BMW's change is more to conform to the current fad than to comply with a new reg? Still . . .

Boss330 · 08-07-2013, 02:23 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by hinckley

Yikes! Glad it's you reading this stuff and not me. But I still don't understand the change of position. It seems to me that the markers located on the fenders are better seen from the rear than the very small area of light emitted to the rear from the mirror-mounted markers.

I hadn't thought so, but maybe BMW's change is more to conform to the current fad than to comply with a new reg? Still . . .

It's not a new reg, so there is nothing new there. It's more following the trend I guess, and they are obviously more visible from the front than the fender mounted ones. And per regs, it has to be just as visible from the rear as the fender mounted ones (as it's the same reg that applies to both).

And as you could see from page 19, your guess as to the side indicators purpose was spot on

08-06-2013, 12:37 PM	#1
hinckley Brigadier General 3493 Rep 3,213 Posts Drives: '24 M4C Conv Join Date: Mar 2010 Location: South Florida iTrader: (1)	Purpose of side markers located on mirrors? I've lived, worked and traveled to Europe on and off over the past 30+ years, and as life-long motorhead, I was always interested in the differences between American and European cars. Way back when, the side markers on European cars were always on the front fenders. I always figured that they were placed there to notify other cars that were approaching from the side - for example, if you were being overtaken or if you were pulling out of a parking space. In those instances, the front and rear direction signals are not always visible. So for that reason, the side markers on the fenders were very smart to me. But now all the side markers are being moved to the mirrors, I believe in accordance with new European legal requirements, and I'm confused. Located on the mirrors, the markers are now mainly visible to cars approaching head on, just like the markers in the front of the car. So to me, the purpose is duplicative and their side functionality is lost. But I'm sure that the brains of Brussels had something else in mind. What am I missing? __________________ CURRENT: '24 M4C Conv RETIRED : '23 M8C Conv \| '20 X4 M40i \| '18 M4 6MT \| '13 M5 6MT \| '08 550i 6MT \| '04 545i 6MT \| '98 540i 6MT \| '94 530i 5MT \| '84 528e 5MT Other retirees from Chevrolet, Buick, Subaru, Honda, Acura, Merkur(!), Volvo, Saab, Audi and Porsche
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08-07-2013, 09:57 AM	#2
Netwon Second Lieutenant 8 Rep 222 Posts Drives: '12 BMW M5 Alpine White Join Date: Nov 2012 Location: Northern Alberta iTrader: (0) Garage List 2012 BMW M5 [0.00]	Shhhhh!!! Don't encourage the EU for anymore regulations!!!!! Our quiet M5 exhausts are proof of that!!!
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08-07-2013, 12:45 PM	#4
24601 Major 95 Rep 1,318 Posts Drives: Toy Join Date: Oct 2009 Location: Oahu, Hawaii iTrader: (5) Garage List 2015 Subaru Outback [0.00] 2015 Toyota Tacoma [0.00] 2013 BMW M3 [10.00]	Good point. This should not have been changed from fender to mirror. It just makes it worse. From the 3/4 rear angle you can see a fender blinker, not on a mirror, nor can you see it dead on, if I'm correct. Stupid Americans. __________________ Sold - 2014 F01 750Li xDrive CBM M-Sport Sold - 2013 E92 M3 SS w/ ZCP l ZPP l 2MK l 6NR l 752 Sold - 2009 E92 335i LMB M-Sport Sold - 2003 E46 M3 LSB SMG
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08-07-2013, 12:59 PM	#6
24601 Major 95 Rep 1,318 Posts Drives: Toy Join Date: Oct 2009 Location: Oahu, Hawaii iTrader: (5) Garage List 2015 Subaru Outback [0.00] 2015 Toyota Tacoma [0.00] 2013 BMW M3 [10.00]	Looking on bmwusa.com, BYO M5, looks like it will remain on the fender. You lucky guy! __________________ Sold - 2014 F01 750Li xDrive CBM M-Sport Sold - 2013 E92 M3 SS w/ ZCP l ZPP l 2MK l 6NR l 752 Sold - 2009 E92 335i LMB M-Sport Sold - 2003 E46 M3 LSB SMG
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