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      08-16-2009, 03:13 AM   #23
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It will be a 600hp TT V10 & nothing less. This is BMW ladies & gents.
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      08-16-2009, 03:40 AM   #24
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Are we sure it is not v8 TT M5 being tested with E60 M5 V10 as oppose to F10 M5 with V8 and V10? There may be something lost in translation.
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      08-16-2009, 07:28 AM   #25
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Wow!

I hope that this time there will be a M5 Xdrive! A sportier Xdrive than X5 or X6; it's important to compete with Audi and in particular with the RS6!
IMHO
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      08-16-2009, 07:54 AM   #26
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Robert View Post
Are we sure it is not v8 TT M5 being tested with E60 M5 V10 as oppose to F10 M5 with V8 and V10? There may be something lost in translation.
That is true, but there are two F10 test cars together so we have to assume there is some major difference between the two cars that warrants them being tested side by side. Also the people on the scene would hear the cars and could probably tell the difference in the engine tone. Afterall, it was the spy photographers who were telling us way in advance that the new M3 has a V8 engine from the sound of the car...
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      08-16-2009, 08:10 AM   #27
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The M5 will have the same TT V8 as the X6M does. And take a look at the performance of the X6M - 0-60 in 4.1 secs! What do you think that number is going to be in the lighter M5 chassis - my bet 3.7 or so. That's a killer car.
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      08-16-2009, 10:18 AM   #28
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from a business standpoint, BMW has made it clear that its days of placing N/A engines in performance cars are over. BMW has already signaled that future cars will be lighter weight, force inducted, and direct fuel injected. Chances are they are trying to tweak whether a V10TT or a V8TT will be the way foward for them in the line up of performance based cars.

For example, would a V10TT 5L engine be more effecient than a V8 TT 5.5L?

I think more and more companies are going to go the Nissan GTR route. pack alot of punch in as small of an engine as possible. Proper cooling, a/f ratios, boost levels, turbo siz/lag all of those things are going to play a part.

I for one think a V10 is bit overkills for the kind of performance numbers you can get out of a V8. If done properly you can get 650 HP from a V8tt 5.0L engine without breaking a sweat. I believe this will be probably be a lot more HP than BMW will be willing to put into their M5.

I believe you will get a new BMW which will produce 30-50more HP than the current version, but, loose approximately 200-300 lbs. while increasing fuel effeciency by 15%.
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      08-16-2009, 10:30 AM   #29
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      08-16-2009, 11:07 AM   #30
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Having personally spoken to the engineers on this project (F10 M5), they are currently (and have been) exploring the V10 and V8 routes for this vehicle. Here is an inside tip- if the German "clause" in the US emissions rules goes into effect it may be a V10- if not we will see a TT V8, to deal with the emissions issues. They can get performance of the V8 up there but from a marketing standpoint the V10 is a kick in the pants of other brands. The V10 will be smaller in displacement than the current engine and be turbo charged as well, featuring a trick induction system similar to the CCM on the X5/X6 ///M.

Having experienced the X6 ///M extensively it think many narrow minded "enthusiasts" will be impressed by that motor, it is ridiculous.

On a side note- Whoever thinks that the current ///M3 is unispired/lackluster is clueless and has either never driven it or does not get it, it is by far the best ///M yet though the steering is a bit over boosted at times....

I still prefer the current M3 to any other product out there, it will compete with cars twice its price- enough said.

-M
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      08-16-2009, 11:42 AM   #31
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my bet is it will be a TT v8 with around 600-650hp
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      08-16-2009, 11:46 AM   #32
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Quote:
Originally Posted by mapezzul View Post
On a side note- Whoever thinks that the current ///M3 is unispired/lackluster is clueless and has either never driven it or does not get it, it is by far the best ///M yet though the steering is a bit over boosted at times....

I still prefer the current M3 to any other product out there, it will compete with cars twice its price- enough said.

-M
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      08-16-2009, 12:42 PM   #33
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Quote:
Originally Posted by mapezzul View Post
Having personally spoken to the engineers on this project (F10 M5), they are currently (and have been) exploring the V10 and V8 routes for this vehicle. Here is an inside tip- if the German "clause" in the US emissions rules goes into effect it may be a V10- if not we will see a TT V8, to deal with the emissions issues. They can get performance of the V8 up there but from a marketing standpoint the V10 is a kick in the pants of other brands. The V10 will be smaller in displacement than the current engine and be turbo charged as well, featuring a trick induction system similar to the CCM on the X5/X6 ///M.

Having experienced the X6 ///M extensively it think many narrow minded "enthusiasts" will be impressed by that motor, it is ridiculous.

On a side note- Whoever thinks that the current ///M3 is unispired/lackluster is clueless and has either never driven it or does not get it, it is by far the best ///M yet though the steering is a bit over boosted at times....

I still prefer the current M3 to any other product out there, it will compete with cars twice its price- enough said.

-M
Excellent information, and, thanks for the backup...
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      08-16-2009, 03:03 PM   #34
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V8TT.
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      08-16-2009, 03:30 PM   #35
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Quote:
Originally Posted by mapezzul View Post
On a side note- Whoever thinks that the current ///M3 is unispired/lackluster is clueless and has either never driven it or does not get it, it is by far the best ///M yet though the steering is a bit over boosted at times....

I still prefer the current M3 to any other product out there, it will compete with cars twice its price- enough said.

-M
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It makes it difficult for me to believe because of the sheer envy they possess, they actually own a BMW at all. Having driven all three cars, there is no other explanation other than sheer envy for this.
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      08-16-2009, 05:18 PM   #36
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I think that they should put a modified X5/X6 M engine in, the 4.4l V8 TT. Just make it rev till at least 7.5K, over 600 hp, over 700 Nm, and at least 150 kg lighter. The 5.5l V10 TT, derived from the 4.4l V8 TT (two cylinders added) should go to the M7, 5.5l V10 690 hp and then on an M8 (7 Coupe). As for those who say you can get a 550i (4.4l V8 TT 407 hp) insted of an M5 (4.4l V8 TT ~600 hp) and tune it, it still will not be an M5, for there is not only engine output but also chassis and weight saving. Yet do not forget that the M5 will also be able to tuned.
550i 4.4l V8 TT 407 hp > 550 hp
M5 4.4l V8 TT 555 hp > 700 hp
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      08-16-2009, 07:13 PM   #37
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What about a supercharged version of the S65 found in the current M3? ESS is claiming ~600whp and the torque and power curves are.... beautiful. No reason BMW couldn't build such an engine from the ground up.
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      08-16-2009, 08:27 PM   #38
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Imola.ZHP View Post
l
o
l

@

most of these posts, especially the one that says something about the current e9x M3 being "unspectacular."

sounds like someone is angry he could only afford a 135i...



/thread
no doubt...lol!
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      08-16-2009, 09:35 PM   #39
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Quote:
Originally Posted by moosety2009 View Post
I for one think a V10 is bit overkills for the kind of performance numbers you can get out of a V8. If done properly you can get 650 HP from a V8tt 5.0L engine without breaking a sweat. I believe this will be probably be a lot more HP than BMW will be willing to put into their M5.

I believe you will get a new BMW which will produce 30-50more HP than the current version, but, loose approximately 200-300 lbs. while increasing fuel effeciency by 15%.
Totally agree from a business standpoint, the 2010 E63 Mercedes will pack only a modest increase to 518 HP, the 2010 XF-R Jag is already weaker than the current M5, the Audi RS6 is way too heavy and is unavailable in the US the largest market for M cars, and the Cadillac CTS-V is only marginally quicker than the current M5. There is no reason for BMW to pack 600+ hp in this car. That said I am sure the TTV8 will probably be close to that figure, and with lower weight it should make for an awesome vehicle with even better handling than the current model.
I personally love the NA M engines (the M3 V8 is a work of art) and will miss them, but times change and so must BMW.
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      08-16-2009, 10:01 PM   #40
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Stankia View Post
A V10 is special, and an M car should be special IMO. If they put a V8TT, how is that any different from a regular 550i V8TT? A software flash and you have the same amount of power in a 550i...
Based on this logic, the last generation M cars weren't special. The E46 M3 had an inline 6 based on the same architecture of the M54 just like the run of the mill E46.Also, the E39 had a V8 (S62) based on the same (M62) motor out of the 540i.

The current X5/6 ///M's are using modified and upgraded version of the same 4.4L BMW N63 motor in the X5/X6 and 750
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      08-16-2009, 10:51 PM   #41
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If BMW puts a V8 into the M5 for US emissions regulations, I hope they install a V10 in the M5 for all the non-US markets. Since they're testing both anyway.
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      08-17-2009, 07:59 AM   #42
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Stankia View Post
The X5/6 M engines have the same displacement and if I'm not mistaken the same redline as the regular V8TT's in the 750i and X6 5.0i, nothing special there.
Same block and that is it. There is a lot special about the new ///M motor...

People really need to experience things and read about the work that goes into them before saying things are not special.

The V8 in the M3 is by far the best motor BMW has made from a design/ performance statement. Oh and it is lighter weight than the CAST IRON I-6 it replaces.

The twin turbo V8 ///M motor is tied with the V10 for second IMHO- I just do not like the sound the turbo produces, it does not have the wail the NA motors do and the cylinder deactivation during shifts makes it burble a bit, but it shifts so nicely it boggles the mind.
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      08-17-2009, 08:53 AM   #43
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Quote:
Originally Posted by 135Eye View Post
That is true, but there are two F10 test cars together so we have to assume there is some major difference between the two cars that warrants them being tested side by side. Also the people on the scene would hear the cars and could probably tell the difference in the engine tone. Afterall, it was the spy photographers who were telling us way in advance that the new M3 has a V8 engine from the sound of the car...
This may be a rumor, but it seems that they are planning on offering 2 variants of the M5, a V8TT and a V10TT. Not sure what the power they will put out, but both should be more powerful than the current E60.
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      08-17-2009, 09:50 AM   #44
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Nobody likes the idea of a supercharged S65 for the F10 M5?
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