Albert Biermann Speaks on BMW F10 M5 - No AWD or Touring Versions. Manual for US.

[Schm]

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Here's parts of an interview with Albert Biermann, Head of Product Development for M Division, by autoblog. He was asked the following F10 M5 relevant questions:

What's the final word on the all-wheel-drive M5?

In short: No. At least, not with the current version. That should put the debate to rest, but Biermann admits that M is looking into it for future models. "There might come a point with torque [output] where you need all-wheel drive," Biermann admitted, but right now, it's not necessary. More interestingly, when we asked about the lack of an electronic torque vectoring differential on the F10 – something we expected to see after the X5 M and X6 M came so equipped – Biermann said that his team tested it early on in the M5's development, but determined that with RWD vehicles, it's unnecessary and overly complex. "We can do more and have more control with the electronic differential," according to Biermann, so for the time being only the X models will get both AWD and the trick diffs.


Where's the M5 wagon?

At this point, one of Biermann's underlings chimed in. "Do you know how many M5 Tourings we sold? 1,056." That's worldwide. And apparently that's just not enough of a business case to justify it for the F10. (Pay no attention to the Cadillac CTS SportsWagon and the meager amount of money needed to covert it to V-spec.) Regardless, M-ified wagons just aren't compelling enough for most buyers for M to invest the time, effort and money to develop. So don't expect an M3 wagon anytime soon either. Not that we were holding our breath...


When do we get a manual M5?

Next year when the M5 makes it Stateside, you'll be able to spec either the seven-speed dual-clutch 'box or a six-speed manual. This fact seems to irritate Biermann. "Here's the problem with the stick," Biermann tells us in a slightly annoyed tone, "only the U.S. wants it. And with the DCT, there's no question about how it will behave. With a manual, the driver is a serious question." Biermann's argument is clear: Driver's suck and the DCT is so good that a manual decreases the performance. Further – and this wasn't explicitly said but clearly implied – the amount of engineering resources that go into adapting the 560-hp sedan to accept a manual cog-swapper is significant. Biermann and his team would undoubtedly prefer to shift those funds and man hours into other endeavors, but they can't because the U.S. – M's largest market – demands it. And Biermann takes it one step further. "I don't know how long we'll be able to keep doing this, but at some point, we'll just have to say 'no'". So is the F10 the last of the manual M5s? We wouldn't be surprised.


Biermann's own BMW M5

Side Note: Biermann asked BMW Individual for "something special" to drive. The result is the beauty above: a custom-painted M5 that's a combination of metallic brown, grey and a subtle shade of purple that shifts in the sunlight. It's gorgeous and doesn't have an official name. Also, he calls the 1M the "little one." Which is just cute.

Link to full gallery
http://www.autoblog.com/photos/alber...#photo-4537024
Article:

http://www.autoblog.com/2011/10/18/s...rned-at-bmw-m/


Let me know if this is a repost

[Raja Ventureshield]

chrome side gills has to go.

otherwise Fantasik looking car

[XDEEDUBBX]

nice color!

[SCOTT26]

New Sable.

[Jon D]

Originally Posted by SCOTT26

New Sable.

Old mushroom.

[flightz71]

I love just because of US, 6-speed stays alive. Completely opposite of what usually happens (US gets shafted of all the good options japan/europe gets in their own market).

It's surprising the engineer would be so annoyed with this. Sure it decreases performance but is there no more desire for the love of a traditional gearbox rowing car? He is the head engineer of M, i would expect him to be somewhat of a purist too (convincing BMW to put in a manual, not discouraging).

I hope enough manuals sell to keep justifying production into future generations. My bigger concern is if it disappears for the M5, M3 is next in line.

It would be sick if the X5M and X6M came in stick too

[tscdennab]

The color looks like turd. It's beyond me how all the colors they can manage to do are in fact...gray. So he drives a gray car and wants us to be excited. No thanks.

On the other hand, a manual M5 really does make sense. Try to drive on a twisty hill with a DCT and with a manual, the experience is 100x more satisfying with the manual gearbox.

[M-Power111]

Originally Posted by Raja Ventureshield

chrome side gills has to go.

otherwise Fantasik looking car

+1

[Zirenz2006]

But according to some on here, real drivers drive stick.

See...you manual drivers are pissing off Albert Biermann.

[Sedan_Clan]

I won't buy a non-manual M car. At that point BMW really will lose me (..or I'll just buy older used models). I don't care about the most technologically advanced transmission; I want to row my own cogs. It's one of the key aspects to driving that I enjoy so much.

[DDS2015]

Well that should put the debates to rest.

So is the US the only market that will be able to order a 6MT? What about Canada?

[SCOTT26]

Originally Posted by Jon D

Old mushroom.

Ha. The color is from Rolls-Royce.

[NewYearsBoy]

Its cool but I still like the old one....

[red-sauerkraut]

LOL Who wants old thinking... DCT is manual, and the shifts are the new standard.

Originally Posted by Zirenz2006

But according to some on here, real drivers drive stick.

See...you manual drivers are pissing off Albert Biermann.

[cmk227]

I think he is confuse. Most of the europe prefer stick. In the US Market we mostly get DTC.

When we were at BMW Welt the delivery guy was happy to see a manual. He told me that he is afraid that eventual they will all be automatic since he does not see that many manual anymore.

[Rich@GTBPerformance]

I highly doubt its only the US that wants a manual. It just so happens that we are the most vocal. We don't just subscribe to the gospel of one man at ///M

[JasonCSU]

Originally Posted by flightz71

I love just because of US, 6-speed stays alive. Completely opposite of what usually happens (US gets shafted of all the good options japan/europe gets in their own market).

It's surprising the engineer would be so annoyed with this. Sure it decreases performance but is there no more desire for the love of a traditional gearbox rowing car? He is the head engineer of M, i would expect him to be somewhat of a purist too (convincing BMW to put in a manual, not discouraging).

I hope enough manuals sell to keep justifying production into future generations. My bigger concern is if it disappears for the M5, M3 is next in line.

It would be sick if the X5M and X6M came in stick too

I'm glad the US will have an option for the 6MT as well. I thought most European countries preferred traditional manuals and laughed at us lazy Americans with our 'automatic' transmissions. I guess either times are changing, or manufacturers are eventually looking to offer only a DCT in most cars because it is supposedly 'the best of both worlds' and will cut costs.

[Yurka]

Well I guess that kills the hope for an AWD M5, shame.

[BMWPower06]

Originally Posted by tscdennab

The color looks like turd. It's beyond me how all the colors they can manage to do are in fact...gray. So he drives a gray car and wants us to be excited. No thanks.
On the other hand, a manual M5 really does make sense. Try to drive on a twisty hill with a DCT and with a manual, the experience is 100x more satisfying with the manual gearbox.

Im going to have to disagree here, while a manual is great for on road driving in normal conditions. A sequential manual is definitely the preferred choice for twisty back roads and on the track, this is coming from experience.

Ps- I rather like that color, its elegant

[PhillyNate]

I'm actually a little offended that a representative is so inconvenienced by making manual transmissions for this small market called AMERICA. Which is actually their largest "M" market. This from people who claim they make "drivers" cars.

[uhn2000]

Originally Posted by PhillyNate

I'm actually a little offended that a representative is so inconvenienced by making manual transmissions for this small market called AMERICA. Which is actually their largest "M" market. This from people who claim they make "drivers" cars.

+1

[bmwpwer]

I understand BMW's point of view on RWD, but the fact is that many people like me that would buy an M car (and have in the past) live in countries where having AWD would make the car much more viable all year round due to weather. If they do not produce M cars with an AWD option, they are loosing many sales. I had a 2009 M3 coupe and while I loved it, it simply was not viable 3-4 months of the year, so I got rid of it. I want another M3, but not until it is AWD.