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      05-16-2012, 01:41 PM   #1
BlackJetE90
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Heads up on Carbon Ceramic brakes - not covered under scheduled maintenance program

Just noticed with the $8,300 carbon ceramic brake option. Their maintenance is not covered under the "scheduled maintenance program".

So any repairs/maintenance will come out of your pocket.


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      05-16-2012, 02:55 PM   #2
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Yep, mentioned that in another thread, along with this:

They also note that "Replacement of these rotors is more expensive than replacement costs of conventional steel/aluminum brake rotors". If Porsche parts costs are anything to go by (and it seems they are considering the option pricing is similar), try ~$4K per rotor compared to ~$400 for steel -- yeah, I'd definitely call that more expensive!

Nice understatement, BMW. Add to that the caveat that "M Carbon Ceramic Brakes are vulnerable to damage from stones and other debris, and must be replaced if damaged or dropped", so if you kick up rocks on an off-track excursion or even nick the rotor while removing or remounting a wheel, you need to replace that rotor and maybe the one on the opposite side of the axle to maintain balance. Pretty pricey proposition, both upfront and over time.

I'd be worried that if I got them, I'd want to keep the car a bit longer than when they wore out, but not so much longer that I'd be able to stomach paying the huge replacement cost since I'd only use a fraction of the new set -- I could also see these actually hurting resale from prospective second owners not wanting to worry about that massive impending replacement cost. But a few reviews here have mentioned very early brake fade even on the street with the steel brakes, which suggests they wouldn't stand up well at all to track duty. Hopefully those reports are overblown or the issues can be fixed with better pads on the steel brakes like the M3.
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      05-16-2012, 02:59 PM   #3
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Quote:
Originally Posted by jphughan View Post
Yep, mentioned that in another thread, along with this:

They also note that "Replacement of these rotors is more expensive than replacement costs of conventional steel/aluminum brake rotors". If Porsche parts costs are anything to go by (and it seems they are considering the option pricing is similar), try ~$4K per rotor compared to ~$400 for steel -- yeah, I'd definitely call that more expensive!

Nice understatement, BMW. Add to that the caveat that "M Carbon Ceramic Brakes are vulnerable to damage from stones and other debris, and must be replaced if damaged or dropped", so if you kick up rocks on an off-track excursion or even nick the rotor while removing or remounting a wheel, you need to replace that rotor and maybe the one on the opposite side of the axle to maintain balance. Pretty pricey proposition, both upfront and over time.

I'd be worried that if I got them, I'd want to keep the car a bit longer than when they wore out, but not so much longer that I'd be able to stomach paying the huge replacement cost since I'd only use a fraction of the new set -- I could also see these actually hurting resale from prospective second owners not wanting to worry about that massive impending replacement cost. But a few reviews here have mentioned very early brake fade even on the street with the steel brakes, which suggests they wouldn't stand up well at all to track duty. Hopefully those reports are overblown or the issues can be fixed with better pads on the steel brakes like the M3.
My M5 is getting cheaper by the moment - no full leather (don't like Sakhir dash), no Exec Pack (don't need anything included other than CA - but since I dont have it now, dont know what Im missing), no B&O , no Ceramic Brakes.

Im looking at 20s and HUD only now I think. After ED and a good deal I think I'll only be paying like $10k more than my C63!
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      05-16-2012, 03:12 PM   #4
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Originally Posted by Patsc23 View Post
My M5 is getting cheaper by the moment - no full leather (don't like Sakhir dash), no Exec Pack (don't need anything included other than CA - but since I dont have it now, dont know what Im missing), no B&O , no Ceramic Brakes.

Im looking at 20s and HUD only now I think. After ED and a good deal I think I'll only be paying like $10k more than my C63!
I'm having the same revelation. My build would be HUD, 20s, possibly 6MT (agonizing over this), and possibly BMW Apps, only for futureproofing if BMW actually does something cool with this and because Pandora is apparently unreliable to control when connected via USB without BMW Apps -- but then again that's a pretty low return for $250. I'd still get Full leather because Silverstone Full looks pretty sweet, but I can see how Sakhir Full might be a bit much for some.

And yeah, B&O is nothing special compared to the base-for-US "Premium Hi-Fi" stereo. I tested them side-by-side and couldn't tell any real difference, and the Premium stereo is very good to excellent.
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      05-16-2012, 03:57 PM   #5
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Quote:
Originally Posted by jphughan View Post
Yep, mentioned that in another thread, along with this:

They also note that "Replacement of these rotors is more expensive than replacement costs of conventional steel/aluminum brake rotors". If Porsche parts costs are anything to go by (and it seems they are considering the option pricing is similar), try ~$4K per rotor compared to ~$400 for steel -- yeah, I'd definitely call that more expensive!
Also bmw warns about high pitched squealing. They aren't joking either. My buddy had carbon ceramic brakes on his GT3 that squealed like crazy. To the point he didn't want to drive the car, it was embarrassing. Porsche didn't do anything about it, saying what bmw says "it is expected". I have seen a lot of guys trying to switch back to steel brakes on their porsches.
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      05-16-2012, 07:56 PM   #6
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      05-16-2012, 08:42 PM   #7
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Quote:
Originally Posted by BlackJetE90 View Post
Also bmw warns about high pitched squealing. They aren't joking either. My buddy had carbon ceramic brakes on his GT3 that squealed like crazy. To the point he didn't want to drive the car, it was embarrassing. Porsche didn't do anything about it, saying what bmw says "it is expected". I have seen a lot of guys trying to switch back to steel brakes on their porsches.
Hehehe.. Porsche mechanic told my buddy that he is simply not driving the car hard enough LOL. So the next day he went nuts and the squealing stopped!
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      05-17-2012, 09:57 AM   #8
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Hehehe.. Porsche mechanic told my buddy that he is simply not driving the car hard enough LOL. So the next day he went nuts and the squealing stopped!
Not surprising, and that's exactly why carbon ceramics really only belong on track cars, because they only perform at their best (and quietest) after you've heated up the rotors. Otherwise you're paying over $8K in options and a lot more over the life of the car just to avoid some brake dust -- even though the rest of the car will still get dirty so you'll have to wash it just as frequently anyway.

Although even Porsche track junkies with PCCB have switched to steel after they've had incidents with rotors cracking or getting chipped with debris and they got tired of paying $4K each to replace them. Sooo...carbon ceramics, even though their whole point is high fade resistance, are only good if you're uber-careful and gentle on track?
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      05-20-2012, 11:18 PM   #9
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BTW, the ceramic brake option on the US Audi RS 5 was announced - $6K. Much cheaper than on the F10 M5, and IIRC pretty similar in size.
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