10-12-2011, 09:55 PM | #45 |
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With the spread of roundabouts across the US we could definitely use the AWD... So I could definitely see BMW coming up w a proprietary lightweight AWD system that would be controllable via m dynamic mode just that the gas mileage would nosedive
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10-13-2011, 03:13 AM | #46 |
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lol are you guys serious ///M enthusiasts? I take it all the people who are asking for an AWD ///M5 have never turned traction control off in their cars and broken the rear end loose...
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10-13-2011, 10:30 AM | #48 |
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Not going to happen on the F10.
They have taken the original comments out of context.
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10-13-2011, 10:37 AM | #49 | |
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Actually, it is not the power, it is the torque that causes traction problems. Like in your example, if the car is 1000lbs lighter, has 450hp BUT revvs to like 12krpm (ie, lower torque) traction will be less of a problem. Of course having 12krpm engine in a production car is just a dream.
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10-13-2011, 11:00 AM | #50 | |
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Assuming that TT engine, than lowering weight will do nothing for traction, even if there is no bump in power from the current TT m5 engine. Obviously if you have a totally different engine than you can create better traction down low. But in the end its always power (aka torque at the wheels) that matters and engine "torque" which you refer to is meaningless as it does not take into account RPM and gearing. But to each his own. Build a lightweight car and put the current m5 engine in and tell me you are not even more limited by traction |
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10-13-2011, 11:01 AM | #51 | |
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Agreed.
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10-13-2011, 12:30 PM | #52 |
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This is all still an assumption, who knows, it may very well turn out that the TT experiment becomes a disaster for bmw and ///M, and an utter failure in the market place.
While the buzz stats sounds nice to some, only after a few years in the market will we understand if bmw and M have destroyed their own enthusiast base with this move to FI. Im one, but not the only, that will never again buy an M due to the shift to FI, it remains to be seen how many people will enjoy the swith over to massive torque and the AMG-esque of the soon to be released M5. Its such an opposite approach to power and motoring that I cant imagine how they greenlighted this to begin with. But regardless, the market will now dictate if the right decision was made, and the next, next m5 will show this further. I can only hope that M either switches back to cars focused on driving dynamics and now stats, or offers more than one variant for each model, like Porsche does. Otherwise they will lose many more customers in the long run. What they should have done of course, was build a lighterweight car (vs the E60) and stroke the S85. Then they would have trully be the market leader, not just another follower of the AMG philosophy.
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10-13-2011, 12:40 PM | #53 |
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The M5 already now weighs almost 2 tons (empty). With an AWD system added, it would get even closer to the X5M cars, which - at least for me - is the antithesis of what M stands for. Even now, the claim from BMW that you can go on a track with the M5 is slightly ridiculous - it's simply to heavy for that. You see almost no M5 at all on the Nordschleife, which is a statement to its untrackeability (sorry just made that word up).
For what reason then buying an M5? Audi has even more experience with AWD cars, such as the RS6. They're also bloated understeering things, but well if BMW goes into that direction anyway... Just my 2c. Alpina_B3_Lux
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10-13-2011, 02:22 PM | #54 | |
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You can postulate until you're blue in the face, but the reality is that BMW is a company that is making a business decision that is in the best interests of solvency. For every one of the dogmatic enthusiasts who decide to no longer invest in the brand there will be another NEW enthusiast who will. BMW hasn't destroyed their enthusiast base. That's a preposterous statement! As long as the company continues to produce automobiles that are powerful, competitive and fun to drive, there will ALWAYS be a place for BMW M. FWIW, people had the same meager outlook when BMW moved to a V8 in the M3. We all see how that turned out. Last edited by Sedan_Clan; 10-13-2011 at 02:27 PM.. |
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10-14-2011, 10:24 AM | #56 | |
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'22 X4 ///M Competition…Carbon Black Metallic/Sakhir Orange...pure driving excitement!!! ‘22 X3 Jetblack + some other stuff not from Munich
Dearly departed...'19 X2 M35i Past lives ‘16 M3…'13 640i GC...'13 335i...'08 M6 ...'05 645Ci...'00 323i...'85 735i...'77 630CSi...'86 325es ...'01 740iL...'09 X3 |
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10-14-2011, 11:23 AM | #57 | |
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It is fair to state that both you and I are making assumptions. Your original statement implied more gravity than your toned down reprisal in the post above. My assumption is based on a historical timeline with the law of probability on my side. A horse a piece! For what it's worth, BMW set dogma aside when they developed ///M SAV's with turbocharged powerplants. The "rules" have already been broken; this is progression (...whether people accept it or not). It will be interesting to witness the reaction of the "forum" community; a community that many consider to be a litmus test for that of the real world. The latter for which I disagree. |
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