Winter Setup NE

[RPiM5]

Originally Posted by bronch

I'll look forward to reading about your experience. I grew up in NY, so I know that "winter" means different things to different people. Now that I'm in the PNW, we may get a few weeks of ice/snow every few years as opposed to the barrage of nor'easters you get, but still drops into the teens and get frozen rain/snow from time to time. I think there's one plow here for 1K square miles, lol and that makes the difference. I'm curious what rim size you have and the tires you're getting, front and back.

I'm planning on getting winter tires for the stock 20" 343M's on the M5. I have found winter tires that are an exact match to the Michelin PSS sizes. So 20/35/265 fronts and 20/30/295 rears. The front and rear tires are different brands with different tread patterns though. I'm not entirely sure that will make any difference. So far I can find anything that says that it will be detrimental to traction by either running different brand setups or by running a staggered winter setup. We'll see when I get them in soon.

[twelve535i]

Wider winter tires will probably provide better traction if conditions are dry/wet but according to Tirerack, narrower tires are for snow.


"Priorities for Sizing Winter Tires Are Different

Original Equipment tire and wheel sizing has evolved over the years to where yesterday's typical 13", 14" and 15" sizes have been replaced with today's 16", 17", 18" and larger sizes. For that matter, many current cars, vans and light trucks now feature wide, low profile tires mounted on large diameter wheels as standard equipment or factory options.

Unfortunately wide, low profile tires have to "plow" a wide path through deep snow, where narrower tires have an easier time. So if you're likely to drive through deep snow this year, you'll want winter / snow tires and wheels in sizes that help put the laws of physics on your side."

[bronch]

Originally Posted by RPiM5

...The front and rear tires are different brands with different tread patterns though. I'm not entirely sure that will make any difference. So far I can find anything that says that it will be detrimental to traction by either running different brand setups or by running a staggered winter setup...

I'm happy to hear that you've taken the plunge. I've searched and searched as well, still haven't read anything about that being detrimental at all. Frankly, common sense says it shouldn't be for this application. I'm going to do the same thing. What brands are you getting then?

[bronch]

Originally Posted by twelve535i

... Unfortunately wide, low profile tires have to "plow" a wide path through deep snow, where narrower tires have an easier time...

I think that may be true in some instances, but tread pattern and tire compound make a big difference as opposed to just tire width. Again, it depends on what "winter" you experience.

[M6-Coupe]

Originally Posted by bronch

.... it depends on what "winter" you experience.

Correct The worst winter I have experienced was in Toronto (Canada) during 5 years I was living there...

[RPiM5]

Originally Posted by bronch

I think that may be true in some instances, but tread pattern and tire compound make a big difference as opposed to just tire width. Again, it depends on what "winter" you experience.

I also think this will matter too. Here in DC, we don't expect to get dumped on by 6 feet of snow in 2 hours, although anything can happen. My main concern is just being able to have good enough traction to drive through a few inches of snow in order to get to work and also to have good enough traction when the the temps outside are -5 degrees F and I want to go for a cruise on dry/wet but not snow covered roads. We all know that summer tires harden up like a rock when temps are really freezing outside. I'm thinking wider winter tires will help with the traction when driving on dry/wet roads and freezing temps. After all, did you guys see that I link I posted in the other thread about how Road and Track tested putting winter tires on a car in the middle of summer and then took it on a race track?

[RPiM5]

Ok, so not to thread jack and not to create yet another thread on Winter Tires, which I know will only eventually be moved to the tires and wheels section by the mods, I am scheduled to install my new Winter Tires this Thursday at my local shop.

Here are the tires that I have ordered:

Rears:
295/30R20 Michelin Pilot Alpin PA4 N-Spec Directional, N0(Porsche)
Serv. Desc: 97V

Fronts:
265/35R20 Dunlop SP Winter Sport 3D
Serv. Desc: 99V

Like I said, they are an exact match to the Michelin Pilot Super Sports High Performance Summer Tires sizes. After exhaustive research I have determined that mixing front and back brands of tires has no detrimental effects on the performance of the car, that is unless you are running drastically different tire types, like All Seasons on the front and High Performance Summers on the rear and you are taking the car on the race track. It is only a bad idea if you run two different tire brands with different tread patterns on the same axle, which is not what I am doing.

As has been stated before, I am not expecting super awesome performance in the snow because I have really wide winter tires on my rear wheels, but instead, I am hoping that traction can be maximized while my M5 wears Winter Tires during the winter months when driving on dry and wet roads during extremely cold and frigid temperatures, such as 30 degrees F to -30 degrees F, like we experienced last winter here in DC. Last winter it wasn't a problem because I kept my M5 in hybernation mostly as I had another car to drive, however for this winter I am down to one car, as I have just sold my Fiat Abarth. So I wanted to keep my M5 mobile throughout the winter months this season. I also decided to not go ahead and purchase a new set of wheels just for winter tires for a few reasons. One being that I love the 343M's and it was hard to imagine putting worse looking wheel on the car. Second, was the extra costs involved. Third, it would be a storage issue for me to have a second set of wheels.

I'll provide an update when I get the new winters installed.

Here is a preview of my winter to come. Lol!

[JOHNBMWM5]

20" Michelin Alpin PA4 yes mixing the tyre types big NO NO.
I have 20/35/255 fronts: 20/35/275 rears (MIchelin Alpin PA4) on my M6 GC CP, they are just great, no problems at all.

[WCH]

Originally Posted by RPiM5

Ok, so not to thread jack and not to create yet another thread on Winter Tires, which I know will only eventually be moved to the tires and wheels section by the mods, I am scheduled to install my new Winter Tires this Thursday at my local shop.

Here are the tires that I have ordered:

Rears:
295/30R20 Michelin Pilot Alpin PA4 N-Spec Directional, N0(Porsche)
Serv. Desc: 97V

Fronts:
265/35R20 Dunlop SP Winter Sport 3D
Serv. Desc: 99V

Like I said, they are an exact match to the Michelin Pilot Super Sports High Performance Summer Tires sizes. After exhaustive research I have determined that mixing front and back brands of tires has no detrimental effects on the performance of the car, that is unless you are running drastically different tire types, like All Seasons on the front and High Performance Summers on the rear and you are taking the car on the race track. It is only a bad idea if you run two different tire brands with different tread patterns on the same axle, which is not what I am doing.

As has been stated before, I am not expecting super awesome performance in the snow because I have really wide winter tires on my rear wheels, but instead, I am hoping that traction can be maximized while my M5 wears Winter Tires during the winter months when driving on dry and wet roads during extremely cold and frigid temperatures, such as 30 degrees F to -30 degrees F, like we experienced last winter here in DC. Last winter it wasn't a problem because I kept my M5 in hybernation mostly as I had another car to drive, however for this winter I am down to one car, as I have just sold my Fiat Abarth. So I wanted to keep my M5 mobile throughout the winter months this season. I also decided to not go ahead and purchase a new set of wheels just for winter tires for a few reasons. One being that I love the 343M's and it was hard to imagine putting worse looking wheel on the car. Second, was the extra costs involved. Third, it would be a storage issue for me to have a second set of wheels.

I'll provide an update when I get the new winters installed.

Not sure about mixing tire brands but for Washington DC, the sizes should be OK. Narrow tires are better than wider tires in snow (especially deeper stuff) but you won't get much of that. As you mentioned, you really need tires that do better at lower temps than get through lots of snow.

My experience so far is that it is easier to spin the rear tires with narrower snow tires in the back but car went through slush fine. I'm mostly concerned about being able to stop.

[RPiM5]

Originally Posted by JOHNBMWM5

20" Michelin Alpin PA4 yes mixing the tyre types big NO NO.
I have 20/35/255 fronts: 20/35/275 rears (MIchelin Alpin PA4) on my M6 GC CP, they are just great, no problems at all.

I understand your concerns. As I have tried to convey, I don't plan on taking the car to the race track with the winter tires on, and I don't plan on attempting to enter a drifting competition during this winter, although that would be fun. We don't get mountains of snow here in this part of the United States and the snow plows do a very good job of clearing most of the major roadways. I don't expect grip and stopping power to be an issue by mixing front and rear tires of the same type (both winter), but if I experience a violent out of control situation, then I will get different tires. I just need my car to mostly get me to my place of work every day during this winter, nothing more really. In this part of the USA there are no mountains and no rally events during the winter, so I don't planning on driving in those conditions either.

[Dionysus]

Dave - seems logical if you can avoid snow/ice driving - would be good to get some feedback on traction with the wide winter compound setup.

And on the subject of Abarth, have you seen this: -

http://www.autocar.co.uk/car-review/...biposto-review

[JOHNBMWM5]

Originally Posted by RPiM5

I understand your concerns. As I have tried to convey, I don't plan on taking the car to the race track with the winter tires on, and I don't plan on attempting to enter a drifting competition during this winter, although that would be fun. We don't get mountains of snow here in this part of the United States and the snow plows do a very good job of clearing most of the major roadways. I don't expect grip and stopping power to be an issue by mixing front and rear tires of the same type (both winter), but if I experience a violent out of control situation, then I will get different tires. I just need my car to mostly get me to my place of work every day during this winter, nothing more really. In this part of the USA there are no mountains and no rally events during the winter, so I don't planning on driving in those conditions either.

Yep same conditions here in this part of the UK, not much snow but cold wet conditions, good luck and see how it performs.

[e92MMM]

Originally Posted by RPiM5

Ok, so not to thread jack and not to create yet another thread on Winter Tires, which I know will only eventually be moved to the tires and wheels section by the mods, I am scheduled to install my new Winter Tires this Thursday at my local shop.

Here are the tires that I have ordered:

Rears:
295/30R20 Michelin Pilot Alpin PA4 N-Spec Directional, N0(Porsche)
Serv. Desc: 97V

Fronts:
265/35R20 Dunlop SP Winter Sport 3D
Serv. Desc: 99V

Like I said, they are an exact match to the Michelin Pilot Super Sports High Performance Summer Tires sizes. After exhaustive research I have determined that mixing front and back brands of tires has no detrimental effects on the performance of the car, that is unless you are running drastically different tire types, like All Seasons on the front and High Performance Summers on the rear and you are taking the car on the race track. It is only a bad idea if you run two different tire brands with different tread patterns on the same axle, which is not what I am doing.

As has been stated before, I am not expecting super awesome performance in the snow because I have really wide winter tires on my rear wheels, but instead, I am hoping that traction can be maximized while my M5 wears Winter Tires during the winter months when driving on dry and wet roads during extremely cold and frigid temperatures, such as 30 degrees F to -30 degrees F, like we experienced last winter here in DC. Last winter it wasn't a problem because I kept my M5 in hybernation mostly as I had another car to drive, however for this winter I am down to one car, as I have just sold my Fiat Abarth. So I wanted to keep my M5 mobile throughout the winter months this season. I also decided to not go ahead and purchase a new set of wheels just for winter tires for a few reasons. One being that I love the 343M's and it was hard to imagine putting worse looking wheel on the car. Second, was the extra costs involved. Third, it would be a storage issue for me to have a second set of wheels.

I'll provide an update when I get the new winters installed.

Here is a preview of my winter to come. Lol!

the 295 pa4 rears are awesome! i have a steep driveway and drove right out with a few inches of snow on the ground. i really wanted a performance winter tire for driving in the colder temps. these have great traction in freezing temperatures on dry pavement. i only end up getting stuck in a snow storm a few times so i wasnt going to get a skinnier tire setup for that. i was more concerned about the other 95% of winter driving i do in sub freezing temps. which the wide alpins are great for!

[RPiM5]

Originally Posted by e92MMM

the 295 pa4 rears are awesome! i have a steep driveway and drove right out with a few inches of snow on the ground. i really wanted a performance winter tire for driving in the colder temps. these have great traction in freezing temperatures on dry pavement. i only end up getting stuck in a snow storm a few times so i wasnt going to get a skinnier tire setup for that. i was more concerned about the other 95% of winter driving i do in sub freezing temps. which the wide alpins are great for!

Good to hear man!

I decided to switch my order up based on your recommendation and am going with the Pilot Alpin 245/35/20 for my front wheels instead of the Dunlops. Last Winter got down to -17 degrees F here because of that damned Polar Vortex, but the snow wasn't all too bad. Maybe we can meet up this winter and make a video.

[RPiM5]

Originally Posted by Dionysus

Dave - seems logical if you can avoid snow/ice driving - would be good to get some feedback on traction with the wide winter compound setup.

And on the subject of Abarth, have you seen this: -

http://www.autocar.co.uk/car-review/...biposto-review

Lol! Yeah I had heard about that a little while back. My Abarth was tuned to 200hp and 210tq, it was a very fast little thing. I weighed it at 2,466lbs without me in it. Very fun car, but I am making some lifestyle changes next year so I had to go down to 1 car.

[soooma]

Originally Posted by M6-Coupe

Dave I have recently installed 305 in rear... I feel noticeable improvement in traction... so yes, wider rear tire means better traction; however car is a bit jerky to jump off the line...Looks like the tires are glued to the road

Too late forme -
Thought about it but you guys discouraged me because of insurance issues and difference in diameter! !


Enjoy bro
I'm gonna have to wait a few more thousand miles
What brand?

[M6-Coupe]

Originally Posted by soooma

Too late forme -
Thought about it but you guys discouraged me because of insurance issues and difference in diameter! !


Enjoy bro
I'm gonna have to wait a few more thousand miles
What brand?

Soooma, 305 is too wide for 343M M5, but it fits for 343M M6.
And I got Michelin Pilot Super Sport

[e92MMM]

Originally Posted by M6-Coupe

Soooma, 305 is too wide for 343M M5, but it fits for 343M M6.
And I got Michelin Pilot Super Sport

ton of people run a 305 on the stock m5 20s i have a set on mine.

[M6-Coupe]

Originally Posted by e92MMM

ton of people run a 305 on the stock m5 20s i have a set on mine.

Yes you are right. Tons of people do this but it doesn't mean that this is a right decision. The rear riml of 343M for M5 is 10" wide while the 305/30/20 is recommended by manufacturer for rims with 10.5"-11.5"... So I just told Soooma the Michelin's recommendation.

You may be interested to see the size of BMW M5 343M rims (rear) here which is 20X10:
http://www.realoem.com/bmw/showparts...43&hg=36&fg=15

You also may want to check the spec of 305/30/20 if you double click on spec here:
http://www.tirerack.com/tires/tires....=45-14805147-2

Anyways, it's your car and your decision

[e92MMM]

Scary stuff! I hope my car dosnt spontaneously combust for going against the will of tire tack 😁. Just kidding !!! I like to live one the edge I guess

[RPiM5]

Mika got her new Snow Shoes on today!

I shit you not, about 1 hour after I left the shop, it started snowing! HAHA! It was not even forecast to snow today and the temp at ground level was still 40 degrees F. It completely surprised me but I was happy that I just got the new tires on.

So far they are great. Since they are brand new, there is a small break in period, so the M5 was a little squirmy when leaving the shop at 3/4 throttle. I can tell the sidewall is a little softer, but they definitely feel like Michelins. When I got Mika up to about 80mph, the front end did feel a tiny bit floaty, but that's prolly because they are new still. I got the 245 fronts and they fit the front wheels fine, but the rears barely fit on the stock 20" 343M Pre-LCI M5 wheels.

All I have to say now is, get ready for BMW F10 M5 Snowkhana 2015!

[RajG]

My local dealer suggested putting on the 265/35/20 winter tires all around. They said there should be no issues running that size on the rear tires. Has anyone done this?

Raj