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      10-17-2019, 08:13 AM   #221
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Originally Posted by c1pher View Post
Somehow Audi makes their smaller cars still look premium. I feel this new BMW looks more like a Toyota Corolla. Maybe they worked together on it like they did the Supra?
The masses will never been confused with people of good taste. I'm not sure working with Toyota on a car like this (I do not believe that happened) would ever be considered a bad thing as they know a thing or two about selling compact cars;

2018 Toyota Corolla US sales: 280,886
2018 Audi A3 US sales: 18,305

That said the current generation of A3 is at the end of its cycle and did sell in numbers over 30k in its first few years. You can understand why BMW would want a piece of that pie as current 2 series sales in the USA are miniscule.
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      10-17-2019, 08:46 AM   #222
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I had a e46 commuter car. The massive amount of them on the road still in Chicago is impressive.

If this is a mass produced car and close to the e46/e90 size, I imagine a mass of f44's running the streets and highways of Chicago land once again.

This stated and the reasonable driver says but that was when BMW made a [enter justified or snide objection here] car, I invite you to drive an X2 M35 and imagine it's the f44. In another 4mo these will be on dealer lots drive the real one then ask what'll be my payments on it. As a Sales professional in the Chicago area I'd like to remember when e46 ruled the commute and this may be the perfect commuter.
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      10-17-2019, 08:55 AM   #223
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I really thought X2 was a good entry vehicle, no idea if it sells in the US though
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      10-17-2019, 08:59 AM   #224
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Originally Posted by joshuastein55 View Post
New Mazda 3? Or is that too slow. New ones are pretty impressive inside and out, and drive well, but they are a bit slow, but enough for everyday driving.
Maybe Mazda will stuff their upcoming I-6 into a 3 body with RWD. I suspect they'll have something more 6 sized, though a 4 door variant of something reviving the RX line might be interesting.

It was the original RX7 that got me into my E36. I loved the "trackable" performance, but wanted 4 seats and doors for passenger and hauling space in a pinch, but not more. That's EXACTLY what the small BMW sedans used to provide. I know. My demographic drives X3Ms now. I guess track days are getting too expensive to be regular weekend outings like they used to be.
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      10-17-2019, 09:42 AM   #225
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Why isn't this whole thing put in it's own sub thread like the 2 series coupes and m2 instead of this general bmw area?

Also all the negative on this car resembles when porsche went from the flat 6 to a turbo flat 4 in the 718. It was heresy they all said the sound etc etc. But the car still had performance and handling. This car m228 and m235 is diff again than the rwd variants but perhaps is needed by bmw to compete with Cla and A class at merc and the a3 s3 over st Audi and lesser the Acura ilx.
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      10-17-2019, 09:44 AM   #226
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I really thought X2 was a good entry vehicle, no idea if it sells in the US though
It sells just okay. Sales are still dwarfed by the X3 as Americans prefer larger SUV's. Also once you option up and X2 up you are in the price range of a larger size offering from the Japanese or domestic and it becomes a harder sell to the typical American that values size above all else.
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      10-17-2019, 10:05 AM   #227
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Quote:
Originally Posted by heavyD^2 View Post
The masses will never been confused with people of good taste. I'm not sure working with Toyota on a car like this (I do not believe that happened) would ever be considered a bad thing as they know a thing or two about selling compact cars;

2018 Toyota Corolla US sales: 280,886
2018 Audi A3 US sales: 18,305

That said the current generation of A3 is at the end of its cycle and did sell in numbers over 30k in its first few years. You can understand why BMW would want a piece of that pie as current 2 series sales in the USA are miniscule.
I’m sure if that’s the path they want to take why not? However, as a performance luxury brand, I think it only serves to water BMW down, which is what they have been doing the past 5 years or so. There are still beacons of light but I feel they may be disappearing too. I guess that’s why I ended up with Porsche after my last BMW. I’m still holding out hope.
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      10-17-2019, 10:25 AM   #228
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I just saw one of these on the road for the first time. I couldn't believed it, the front is so out of proportion. Looked so much worse than these pictures.

The new 2GC is not a good looking car, but better than the CLA IMHO.

Still disappointed with overall BMW new designs, this 2GC is so generic.
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      10-17-2019, 10:29 AM   #229
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This car has no unique BMW design elements, except the moustache grill😂
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      10-17-2019, 11:04 AM   #230
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Originally Posted by c1pher View Post
I’m sure if that’s the path they want to take why not? However, as a performance luxury brand, I think it only serves to water BMW down, which is what they have been doing the past 5 years or so. There are still beacons of light but I feel they may be disappearing too. I guess that’s why I ended up with Porsche after my last BMW. I’m still holding out hope.
Too many of you seem to think that BMW's main competition is Porsche. It's not. Audi and MB are their main competition as BMW is not a sports car company like Porsche. They are in the business of selling passenger vehicles that happens to offer some performance vehicles on the side. Heck BMW really doesn't even offer a high end sports car like Audi (R8). "You know I really love the R8, the sound of the V10, the exotic looks, the acceleration but I can't get past the fact that they sell the FWD A3" said nobody ever. IMO too many of you seem to be a little out of touch with the fact that it's volume people pushers that sustain BMW and not the M cars.

I can totally understand the thinking that offering FWD sedans tarnishes the brand but BMW's main competition took this leap years ago and have been profiting from it so it's hard to fault BMW for trying to expand their market because in the marketplace standing still usually means you are being left behind.
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      10-17-2019, 11:15 AM   #231
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This car is absolutely fugly IMO. I currently drive an X3 M40i and an Audi TT. Was considering this car when my TT lease is up, but there's no way I'd buy this. Looks like a Hyundai, Toyota, etc. compact car. ��
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      10-17-2019, 11:18 AM   #232
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Quote:
Originally Posted by heavyD^2 View Post
Too many of you seem to think that BMW's main competition is Porsche. It's not. Audi and MB are their main competition as BMW is not a sports car company like Porsche. They are in the business of selling passenger vehicles that happens to offer some performance vehicles on the side. Heck BMW really doesn't even offer a high end sports car like Audi (R8). "You know I really love the R8, the sound of the V10, the exotic looks, the acceleration but I can't get past the fact that they sell the FWD A3" said nobody ever. IMO too many of you seem to be a little out of touch with the fact that it's volume people pushers that sustain BMW and not the M cars.

I can totally understand the thinking that offering FWD sedans tarnishes the brand but BMW's main competition took this leap years ago and have been profiting from it so it's hard to fault BMW for trying to expand their market because in the marketplace standing still usually means you are being left behind.
Getting new customers into the BMW brand is probably another big reason luxury car OEMs make lower priced FWD based vehicles. The problem I think is that if you make the product too cheap (quality wise), you will lose them forever.
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      10-17-2019, 12:02 PM   #233
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New Kia ! Lol see badge and grill in the front
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      10-17-2019, 12:55 PM   #234
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Quote:
Originally Posted by heavyD^2 View Post
Too many of you seem to think that BMW's main competition is Porsche. It's not. Audi and MB are their main competition as BMW is not a sports car company like Porsche. They are in the business of selling passenger vehicles that happens to offer some performance vehicles on the side. Heck BMW really doesn't even offer a high end sports car like Audi (R8). "You know I really love the R8, the sound of the V10, the exotic looks, the acceleration but I can't get past the fact that they sell the FWD A3" said nobody ever. IMO too many of you seem to be a little out of touch with the fact that it's volume people pushers that sustain BMW and not the M cars.

I can totally understand the thinking that offering FWD sedans tarnishes the brand but BMW's main competition took this leap years ago and have been profiting from it so it's hard to fault BMW for trying to expand their market because in the marketplace standing still usually means you are being left behind.
Well, color me confused as well as most Magazine reviewers because they always seem to pit BMWs against Porsche’s and BMW makes M models which are what exactly? Unless you’re a brand ambassador or in charge of BMWs marketing, I doubt you actually know their positions or market strategy either. But yes, because they are German manufacturers they all get compared against one another. 7 series vs S class or A8 etc.
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      10-17-2019, 01:14 PM   #235
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Quote:
Originally Posted by c1pher View Post
Quote:
Originally Posted by heavyD^2 View Post
Too many of you seem to think that BMW's main competition is Porsche. It's not. Audi and MB are their main competition as BMW is not a sports car company like Porsche. They are in the business of selling passenger vehicles that happens to offer some performance vehicles on the side. Heck BMW really doesn't even offer a high end sports car like Audi (R8). "You know I really love the R8, the sound of the V10, the exotic looks, the acceleration but I can't get past the fact that they sell the FWD A3" said nobody ever. IMO too many of you seem to be a little out of touch with the fact that it's volume people pushers that sustain BMW and not the M cars.

I can totally understand the thinking that offering FWD sedans tarnishes the brand but BMW's main competition took this leap years ago and have been profiting from it so it's hard to fault BMW for trying to expand their market because in the marketplace standing still usually means you are being left behind.
Well, color me confused as well as most Magazine reviewers because they always seem to pit BMWs against Porsche’s and BMW makes M models which are what exactly? Unless you’re a brand ambassador or in charge of BMWs marketing, I doubt you actually know their positions or market strategy either. But yes, because they are German manufacturers they all get compared against one another. 7 series vs S class or A8 etc.
Volume, bmw sells 2.5mm vehicl a year, Porsche sell 10% of that?

Clearly BMW sell a lot thing outside the M stuff...
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      10-17-2019, 01:37 PM   #236
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Originally Posted by msej449 View Post
I wonder if they plan a Touring? (I mean á là 3 Series Touring, not the 2 Active Tourer) I mean, if you're going to compromise on FWD and 4-cyl, then a Tourer is the upside to the compromise. A 'new' 2 Touring would still be longer than my first BMW E30 3 Series Touring back in 1989:

[img]
View post on imgur.com
[/img]

Sadly, both myself and the BMW range have suffered somewhat from middle age spread since then: my 325i Touring above was 170.3" long and the current 2 coupé is 178.5" long. Another retrograde step is that the wipers on those headlights worked way, way better than the hopeless sprayers on my M235i.
You should have kept it! I agree about the wipers. Had them on a few of my 1990's cars. GSi 2000 anyone?
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      10-17-2019, 01:45 PM   #237
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Originally Posted by MZWIE View Post
Why oh why does BMW insist on creating 4 door and X version of everything. Once the bean counters took over the brand image has deteriorated.

I'm glad I picked up an M2 when I did.
A four door M2 grab coupe would have been badass ...

If you want to know why bmw makes a 4 door of everything ....



3 series sells more than 4
5 series sells more than 6
7 series sells more than 8

Even in the SUV models , the larger models sells more than the coupe styles.


X1 sells more than x2
X3 sells more than x4
X5 sells more than x 6
X7 sells ..
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      10-17-2019, 01:45 PM   #238
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I don't hate it in general but I don't see what is BMW about it. It looks like a kia.

Does an E82 (that everyone thought was ugly) not look 10x better than this, as does the 'old' 2 series?

I'm not bashing this new one, I'm bashing calling it a BMW.
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      10-17-2019, 02:03 PM   #239
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Quote:
Originally Posted by DarkstarZero View Post
Mercedes CLA45 AMG
Taking it to extremes.

Renault Megan RS Hatch.
280Hp 6MT flared when arches.
Renault interior though.
Looks wise infinitely better for me.
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      10-17-2019, 02:38 PM   #240
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Disappointing. The Dodge Dart from half a decade ago (and a fraction of the price) looks way better and much more cohesive. It even had a Hofmeister kink and Zicker line! How BMW f's up something as simple as an entry level car is beyond me. Huey-Doinky needs to go.

https://www.motortrend.com/uploads/s...ound%7C875:492

https://www.tokkoro.com/picsup/54977...wallpapers.jpg

https://images.caricos.com/d/dodge/2..._1920x1080.jpg

https://images.dealersync.com/cloud/...a6eb59a49be546
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      10-17-2019, 04:48 PM   #241
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Quote:
Originally Posted by JustChris View Post
Quote:
Originally Posted by ///M TOWN View Post
Quote:
Originally Posted by DarkstarZero View Post
Mercedes CLA45 AMG
Taking it to extremes.

Renault Megan RS Hatch.
280Hp 6MT flared when arches.
Renault interior though.
Looks wise infinitely better for me.
Where is the pix Chris?
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      10-17-2019, 07:13 PM   #242
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I'm not seriously considering this car; and I do think BMW makes better looking vehicles, but these just aren't bad facts about the M235i. IMO the upcoming buck-toothed 4 Series has far more potential to inspire vomiting than this thing. I'd let my girl drive an M235i if she liked it.

301 HP / 332 lb-ft
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