06-30-2018, 03:41 PM | #1 |
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Preventing rods from bending and engine damage.
Hi guys,
Any preventative measures that can be taken to prevent rods from bending when pushing power as opposed to rebuilding engine? |
06-30-2018, 11:09 PM | #4 |
F10 1/4 WR: 9.9s / 142.5mph 1/2 WR: 175.5mph
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Guys. Rods bend for a few reasons:
1. Just a lot of boost... this won’t happen until 900ft-lb torque at the wheels on this V8 2. The #1 season it’s gonna bend is due to tuning. Pre-ignition, detonation etc. can cause even forged rods to bend So... 1. Don’t just go around flooring your 26psi map. Anything above 22psi you need to log first and ramp up 2. ALWAYS run 95 AKI or above. 100AKI for 25psi and 110AKI for 30psi 3. Maintain your plugs, oil and monitor general motor health like lealdown every 5K miles 4. Take an oil analysis every oil change (3K max if you are pushing 800-900hp) My Frozen M5 lasted 20K+ miles at 800/800+ |
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07-03-2018, 01:39 AM | #7 |
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This. The key is to limit the torque and to not run excessive timing in the midrange. A lot of tune files I've seen retain the OEM ignition mapping which actually runs 1-2 deg too much timing at 22psi. Still doesn't knock which is why most tuners don't think to much about it. But you can make the same power with less timing and far lower peak cylinder pressures. Probably the biggest mistake people make is running methanol injection and letting the ECU run an aggressive timing map. It may be knock-free but it's certainly going to induce excessive wear and tear.
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07-03-2018, 01:51 PM | #8 |
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I was always thinking that you'd keep torque at about 725-750nm from as soon as you can (about 2500rpm) and just keep it at that level for as long as possible - perhaps with Pure Stage 2?
That should let you keep 750nm all the way to 7000rpm which works out to a nice 740hp or 550kw. That'd be my ideal tune. |
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07-03-2018, 11:36 PM | #9 | |
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07-04-2018, 11:09 AM | #10 |
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lol exactly
Its how quickly the s63tu delivers torque from the low end, add another 200-300lbs of torque and the same map structure on the low end and you're asking for trouble. Or doing 200mph pulls where the air above 150 is like molasses making the engine work. Best thing you could do is have lower torque I'd say over 650+wtrq and aggressive low end power/ LONG 180-200pulls you're asking for when not if situation. |
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07-04-2018, 09:37 PM | #11 | |
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07-05-2018, 10:57 AM | #12 | |
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All one needs to do is look at the GTR platform and how them launching cars with 650wtrq on stock motor blows rods out of the block and half mile stock motor cars making equally high amounts of torque and doing long 180+mph pulls and having the rods let go or bend. Same concept here possibly even worse with how the torque comes on in these, and the weight its carrying which is +400lbs compared to a GTR. Either way 650wtrq or above and abuse in either low or high high end seems to be asking for trouble zone. |
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07-06-2018, 05:10 PM | #13 | |
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07-09-2018, 06:03 PM | #14 |
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07-10-2018, 06:30 AM | #15 |
F10 1/4 WR: 9.9s / 142.5mph 1/2 WR: 175.5mph
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The only cars making 750-800whp and NOT having blown up are the dyno queens. Pretty much every car making 750whp+ that actually did any real racing has blown up already.
Last edited by allmotor_2000; 07-11-2018 at 08:12 PM.. |
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07-11-2018, 10:24 AM | #16 | |
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you are pretty much the one who took the leap to push the platform forward. |
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07-11-2018, 03:05 PM | #17 | |
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Any good tuners you recommend in SoCal? |
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07-11-2018, 11:25 PM | #18 |
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Here's a good example of what we are doing to minimize engine stress on the S63Tu. Below is a dyno graph comparing our once stock 2015 F10 M5 with Competition Package with it the same car modified with a prototype OTS Stg1 tune and Ti exhaust (OEM downpipes with catalysts still installed):
The goal was to keep peak torque limited to ~550lbft while trying to maintain it as high in the rev range as possible. Results in a rather healthy ~630whp. But more importantly, the conservative torque in the midrange keeps charge temps cool which means less sensitivity to heat soak and higher knock resistance. This also makes the car easier to drive since there is no big whallup of torque in midrange that tends to bend rods and, at best, makes the car less manageable to drive hard. Last edited by OpenFlash; 07-12-2018 at 11:16 AM.. |
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07-12-2018, 08:15 AM | #19 |
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07-12-2018, 09:58 AM | #20 |
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07-12-2018, 02:20 PM | #21 |
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I'd love to see that tune with Pure Stage 2. Keep torque to 550lbft for as long as possible - in the chart above it drops below 550lbft at about 5000rpm, if it could keep that flat until 6000rpm that would be great.
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07-12-2018, 03:07 PM | #22 |
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What's a proven tune you are recommending?
I'm also interested. Currently just switched to JB4 + BCM with bluetooth v3. Car has CBE and Intake.
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