M5POST
BMW Garage BMW Meets Register Search Today's Posts Mark Forums Read

Go Back   M5POST - BMW M5 Forum > F10 M5 Forum > BMW M5 (F10) General Forum

Post Reply
 
Thread Tools Search this Thread
      12-27-2019, 10:48 PM   #23
JoeKhoda
Private
31
Rep
57
Posts

Drives: 2013 F10 M5
Join Date: Jul 2018
Location: Sacile, IT

iTrader: (0)

Quote:
Originally Posted by charlis777 View Post
most of your injectors came out with the decoupling elements attached to them. how did you manage taking other ones out i'm kinda struggling getting them out
I just used a scribe/pick tool to fish them out. Didn't take much effort. Feel free to pm if you need any more info.
Appreciate 0
      12-27-2019, 10:54 PM   #24
JoeKhoda
Private
31
Rep
57
Posts

Drives: 2013 F10 M5
Join Date: Jul 2018
Location: Sacile, IT

iTrader: (0)

Quote:
Originally Posted by 5soko View Post
So for installation you just pushed the injectors down into there vallets and then bolted them down?

I know TIS says to use the toll for install but doesnt really make sense, i figured you can just push them in and bolt them in as you did and it will be fine.
You are correct. I tried using the tool to install, but was way more cumbersome messing with 2nm counterclockwise with a crows foot. I just made sure they were seated and flush. The brackets do a good job of seating them down. I was just really careful and checked for leaks.
Appreciate 0
      12-27-2019, 11:06 PM   #25
JoeKhoda
Private
31
Rep
57
Posts

Drives: 2013 F10 M5
Join Date: Jul 2018
Location: Sacile, IT

iTrader: (0)

Quote:
Originally Posted by M5theonlyone View Post
Mines a '13 with 35k miles and I don't think there is reason to panic and replace all injectors.
The original injectors were tested to maximum before car was released to the public and I'm still in the dark about what injectors you should replace them with should you want to go ahead for just peace of your own mind.Someone in NY had a replacement engine and he's saying THAT engine failed because of wrong injectors fitted...
You would need to double check with ISTA.

Vehicle management - Service Functions - Powertrain - Engine Electronics - Injector Determination

I've heard of ways to program EU6 to work in EU5 cars, but I was on a time constraint and just went with what the car asked for.
Appreciate 1
M5Rick58412.50
      12-27-2019, 11:09 PM   #26
JoeKhoda
Private
31
Rep
57
Posts

Drives: 2013 F10 M5
Join Date: Jul 2018
Location: Sacile, IT

iTrader: (0)

Quote:
Originally Posted by gary_F10M5 View Post
Quote:
Originally Posted by JoeKhoda View Post
Quote:
Originally Posted by Craze View Post
Did u program the dme for new injectors?
You bet! Loaded via ISTA.
Hi OP, do you need to do a DME adaptation reset after changing and registering the injectors? Thanks.
Yes. Reset all adaptations after registering injectors.
Appreciate 0
      12-27-2019, 11:17 PM   #27
JoeKhoda
Private
31
Rep
57
Posts

Drives: 2013 F10 M5
Join Date: Jul 2018
Location: Sacile, IT

iTrader: (0)

Quote:
Originally Posted by Jasoneo5 View Post
Quote:
Originally Posted by PerfM5 View Post
I thought the full fuel system was under 120K mile warranty. At least that what I was told by my dealer.
Yeah, I've heard similar but I also assume there are a few issues with this:
1) Tuning void warranty
2) BMW only pays for the injector that failed, not the all of them
3) A failed/failing injector can bomb the whole engine which BMW wouldn't cover
Quote:
Originally Posted by rickyf10 View Post
Quote:
Originally Posted by Bimmma View Post
BMW has actually issued extended warranty on these injectors. Some of you may have gotten the letter last year. 10 yr/120000 miles.
Wonder if the extended warranty is available in Canada or just states
Quote:
Originally Posted by PerfM5 View Post
I thought the full fuel system was under 120K mile warranty. At least that what I was told by my dealer.
Quote:
Originally Posted by Jasoneo5 View Post
Quote:
Originally Posted by PerfM5 View Post
I thought the full fuel system was under 120K mile warranty. At least that what I was told by my dealer.
Yeah, I've heard similar but I also assume there are a few issues with this:
1) Tuning void warranty
2) BMW only pays for the injector that failed, not the all of them
3) A failed/failing injector can bomb the whole engine which BMW wouldn't cover

From what I've read, it only applies to vehicles physically in North America. I'm currently over in Italy and dealing with BMW dealership over here is a huge waste of time and money.

Brought my car in once, they had no idea what to do. Spent more on a rental car (no loaners here) while they troubleshot.

Rather than trying to save a buck, I went ahead and fixed it myself.
Appreciate 1
M5Rick58412.50
      12-27-2019, 11:26 PM   #28
JoeKhoda
Private
31
Rep
57
Posts

Drives: 2013 F10 M5
Join Date: Jul 2018
Location: Sacile, IT

iTrader: (0)

I will note for anyone that suspects leaky injectors, upon replacement, DON'T FORGET TO CHANGE THE OIL.

If there is any suspicion of fuel in the cylinder, you can bet it's made it to the sump. It's not worth it, spend the extra $100 when you order parts and change it.
Appreciate 0
      01-04-2020, 11:29 AM   #29
Fast400
Major
Fast400's Avatar
Germany
676
Rep
1,115
Posts

Drives: iX M60
Join Date: May 2014
Location: ...

iTrader: (0)

Garage List
2014 BMW  [0.00]
Great write up! Thanks for sharing
Appreciate 1
      03-13-2020, 06:59 PM   #30
JoeKhoda
Private
31
Rep
57
Posts

Drives: 2013 F10 M5
Join Date: Jul 2018
Location: Sacile, IT

iTrader: (0)

Quote:
Originally Posted by Fast400 View Post
Great write up! Thanks for sharing
Thank you!
Appreciate 0
      04-24-2020, 04:14 PM   #31
JoeKhoda
Private
31
Rep
57
Posts

Drives: 2013 F10 M5
Join Date: Jul 2018
Location: Sacile, IT

iTrader: (0)

UPDATE: After 2000 miles, finally got a CEL and same 118111 code came back. No DTM. Pulled plugs, no wetting and they look ok.

Then went to looking at the downpipes for any sign of leaks. I don't have access to my local shop's smoke machine since everything is still closed here in Italy. Here's what I found.

Noticed a huuuge gap on the clamps. Not sure if that could be a cause for any leaks, but it seems to be pretty clean and dry so far. I'll take a deeper look when I get home tonight. Will also remove/inspect/clean both MAFs as well.

Anyone have any other suggestions?
Attached Images
   
Appreciate 0
      04-24-2020, 04:32 PM   #32
rickyf10
Private First Class
rickyf10's Avatar
Canada
50
Rep
140
Posts

Drives: F80 M3
Join Date: May 2019
Location: VANCOUVER

iTrader: (0)

Quote:
Originally Posted by JoeKhoda View Post
UPDATE: After 2000 miles, finally got a CEL and same 118111 code came back. No DTM. Pulled plugs, no wetting and they look ok.

Then went to looking at the downpipes for any sign of leaks. I don't have access to my local shop's smoke machine since everything is still closed here in Italy. Here's what I found.

Noticed a huuuge gap on the clamps. Not sure if that could be a cause for any leaks, but it seems to be pretty clean and dry so far. I'll take a deeper look when I get home tonight. Will also remove/inspect/clean both MAFs as well.

Anyone have any other suggestions?
I got the same experience here. Got the first rich condition at 90k kms and then replaced all 8 injectors. Car ran fine for the next 3000 kms and the mysterious rich mixture came back it turned out to be a faulty post cat o2 sensor (yes only 1 gone bad) the symptom are sometimes rough idle on startup and occasionally throwing rich mixture codes (mostly at idle, you can look it up for code details on ISTA ). Ended up buying a pair of new post cat o2 sensors on FCP

So highly suggest you to look at voltage graphs of all 4 o2 sensors on ISTA+
Appreciate 1
      04-24-2020, 04:36 PM   #33
JoeKhoda
Private
31
Rep
57
Posts

Drives: 2013 F10 M5
Join Date: Jul 2018
Location: Sacile, IT

iTrader: (0)

Quote:
Originally Posted by rickyf10 View Post
I got the same experience here. Got the first rich condition at 90k kms and then replaced all 8 injectors. Car ran fine for the next 3000 kms and the mysterious rich mixture came back it turned out to be a faulty post cat o2 sensor (yes only 1 gone bad) the symptom are sometimes rough idle on startup and occasionally throwing rich mixture codes (mostly at idle, you can look it up for code details on ISTA ). Ended up buying a pair of new post cat o2 sensors on FCP

So highly suggest you to look at voltage graphs of all 4 o2 sensors on ISTA+
Thanks for the heads up, brotha! Will do that asap! Ill let you guys know how it goes. Cheers..
Appreciate 0
      04-24-2020, 04:43 PM   #34
rickyf10
Private First Class
rickyf10's Avatar
Canada
50
Rep
140
Posts

Drives: F80 M3
Join Date: May 2019
Location: VANCOUVER

iTrader: (0)

mine's looks like this:
Name:  0308_1.jpg
Views: 1520
Size:  389.7 KB
Name:  0308_2.jpg
Views: 1460
Size:  43.0 KB
See how the line fluctuates badly. When we saw the graph, we were pretty sure the post cat o2 sensor's gone bad, since the pre cat o2 on the same bank read normal (red line and orange line overlaps on the graph, glad to see that )
btw, my faulty o2 doesnt constantly give wrong voltage, that's why it doesnt always throw rich mixture code
Appreciate 1
      04-24-2020, 04:59 PM   #35
JoeKhoda
Private
31
Rep
57
Posts

Drives: 2013 F10 M5
Join Date: Jul 2018
Location: Sacile, IT

iTrader: (0)

Quote:
Originally Posted by rickyf10 View Post
See how the line fluctuates badly. When we saw the graph, we were pretty sure the post cat o2 sensor's gone bad, since the pre cat o2 on the same bank read normal (red line and orange line overlaps on the graph, glad to see that )
btw, my faulty o2 doesnt constantly give wrong voltage, that's why it doesnt always throw rich mixture code
So I tried running that check last night, and both O2s on bank 2 would not heat up. Bank 1 was instant.

What version of ISTA do you have? Mine seems to be an earlier version.
Attached Images
 
Appreciate 0
      04-24-2020, 05:59 PM   #36
rickyf10
Private First Class
rickyf10's Avatar
Canada
50
Rep
140
Posts

Drives: F80 M3
Join Date: May 2019
Location: VANCOUVER

iTrader: (0)

Quote:
Originally Posted by JoeKhoda View Post
So I tried running that check last night, and both O2s on bank 2 would not heat up. Bank 1 was instant.

What version of ISTA do you have? Mine seems to be an earlier version.
Not really sure where I can see the exact version of ISTA. Yep, from what I can see on the picture, mine seems to be a later version V32.
For your case here, I’m not really sure if faulty o2s cause both pre cat and post cat below limit. For heating up o2s, I would try to drive around for a while first and then perform the check operation. Then try to swap o2s on both banks to rule out o2 failure.
Appreciate 0
      04-24-2020, 06:42 PM   #37
JoeKhoda
Private
31
Rep
57
Posts

Drives: 2013 F10 M5
Join Date: Jul 2018
Location: Sacile, IT

iTrader: (0)

Quote:
Originally Posted by rickyf10 View Post
Quote:
Originally Posted by JoeKhoda View Post
So I tried running that check last night, and both O2s on bank 2 would not heat up. Bank 1 was instant.

What version of ISTA do you have? Mine seems to be an earlier version.
Not really sure where I can see the exact version of ISTA. Yep, from what I can see on the picture, mine seems to be a later version V32.
For your case here, I’m not really sure if faulty o2s cause both pre cat and post cat below limit. For heating up o2s, I would try to drive around for a while first and then perform the check operation. Then try to swap o2s on both banks to rule out o2 failure.
Agreed. For now I'll swap left to right to see if the problem follows before I put an order in.

Only bad part about living overseas. Min 2 weeks for parts from the states.

I'll also look at updating my ISTA.
Appreciate 0
      04-25-2020, 05:40 PM   #38
JoeKhoda
Private
31
Rep
57
Posts

Drives: 2013 F10 M5
Join Date: Jul 2018
Location: Sacile, IT

iTrader: (0)

Swapped post cat O2s left to right, and ran tests. No change. Still fails to heat up both lambda probes on bank 2. Other than updating ISTA, I'm kind of at a loss. Don't know where to go next.
Appreciate 0
      04-26-2020, 03:48 AM   #39
Dwaynos
Captain
Dwaynos's Avatar
United Kingdom
378
Rep
948
Posts

Drives: F10 M5 Monte Carlo Blue
Join Date: May 2018
Location: UK

iTrader: (0)

Quote:
Originally Posted by JoeKhoda View Post
Swapped post cat O2s left to right, and ran tests. No change. Still fails to heat up both lambda probes on bank 2. Other than updating ISTA, I'm kind of at a loss. Don't know where to go next.
The lambdas should heat up fast because they are fitted with a heater to speed up the process. Either both sensors are bad or they're not being controlled.
Appreciate 0
      04-26-2020, 08:20 AM   #40
JoeKhoda
Private
31
Rep
57
Posts

Drives: 2013 F10 M5
Join Date: Jul 2018
Location: Sacile, IT

iTrader: (0)

Installed the latest version of ISTA I could find (4.22.13) Ended up having to reinstall windows to get it to work.

Anyways, it was able to get past the O2 warm up phase no problem. Here are the results from the tests. Bank 2 post cat is spiking. But this is after I swapped around left and right post cat sensors.

In between tests I swapped around the MAFs as well, no change.

What would this indicate if we can rule out the sensor being bad? Seems to me like it's actually reporting the problem not being the problem itself?
Attached Images
  
Appreciate 0
      04-26-2020, 09:45 AM   #41
Dwaynos
Captain
Dwaynos's Avatar
United Kingdom
378
Rep
948
Posts

Drives: F10 M5 Monte Carlo Blue
Join Date: May 2018
Location: UK

iTrader: (0)

Looks like you could have a bad cat on bank 2 as the post cat sensor appears to be slightly switching rich to lean. Check for any leaks between the pre and post cat sensors although this is unlikely.
Appreciate 0
      04-26-2020, 09:59 AM   #42
JoeKhoda
Private
31
Rep
57
Posts

Drives: 2013 F10 M5
Join Date: Jul 2018
Location: Sacile, IT

iTrader: (0)

Quote:
Originally Posted by Dwaynos View Post
Looks like you could have a bad cat on bank 2 as the post cat sensor appears to be slightly switching rich to lean. Check for any leaks between the pre and post cat sensors although this is unlikely.
Thats what I was thinking too. I still have the original cats. Might try to swap them in after the engine cools off.
Appreciate 0
      04-26-2020, 11:32 AM   #43
Dwaynos
Captain
Dwaynos's Avatar
United Kingdom
378
Rep
948
Posts

Drives: F10 M5 Monte Carlo Blue
Join Date: May 2018
Location: UK

iTrader: (0)

Quote:
Originally Posted by JoeKhoda View Post
Thats what I was thinking too. I still have the original cats. Might try to swap them in after the engine cools off.
What cats are you using now?
Appreciate 0
      04-26-2020, 11:33 AM   #44
JoeKhoda
Private
31
Rep
57
Posts

Drives: 2013 F10 M5
Join Date: Jul 2018
Location: Sacile, IT

iTrader: (0)

Quote:
Originally Posted by Dwaynos View Post
What cats are you using now?
ESS high flow catted downpipes are currently installed.
Appreciate 0
Post Reply

Bookmarks

Thread Tools Search this Thread
Search this Thread:

Advanced Search

Posting Rules
You may not post new threads
You may not post replies
You may not post attachments
You may not edit your posts

BB code is On
Smilies are On
[IMG] code is On
HTML code is Off



All times are GMT -5. The time now is 06:35 AM.




m5post
Powered by vBulletin® Version 3.8.11
Copyright ©2000 - 2024, vBulletin Solutions Inc.
1Addicts.com, BIMMERPOST.com, E90Post.com, F30Post.com, M3Post.com, ZPost.com, 5Post.com, 6Post.com, 7Post.com, XBimmers.com logo and trademark are properties of BIMMERPOST