[- Paul -]

Just read this article and thought I'd post it up here for discussion.

"
EVER get fed up of hearing about the north-south divide? Well perhaps you should take a closer look, because what emerges is a very different picture.
According to the Nationwide Building Society, the average house price in England is £170,111, while in Yorkshire and the Humber it’s £157,959. Not much of a difference you might think, but what is interesting is the way the figures are calculated, because here it’s more like a north-north divide.
Let’s start with two identical properties; one in York, the other in Hull. No prizes for guessing which will be the most expensive, but it may surprise you to learn that the one in York would cost twice as much.
Or how about a family house in the centre of Harrogate? Well, you’ll need deep pockets and about £1 million to play with; more like £2 million if it’s detached.
But in the mill towns of West Yorkshire there are hundreds of back-to-backs. The ones boarded-up in deprived areas are worthless, while those in better locations go for around £40,000. Hardly enough for a deposit in York.
So it doesn’t take a mathematician to work out that with such disparate housing stock, the averages are going to be hugely distorted and that is how one of the north-south divide myths is perpetuated.
Don’t believe me? Well there are no back-to-backs in Esher to drag down the index and at first sight the Surrey town appears more expensive than any in North Yorkshire. Not necessarily true; a reasonable two-bedroomed flat there will set you back about £250,000, as it will in York and Harrogate, and most of the latter’s apartments are more likely to set you back at least a third as much again, despite the stated average of £146,000 – and when did you last see one that cheap?
Then there are social issues; the other north-south divide myth. Apparently it’s grim up north. Well not as grim as in parts of London where five local authorities have the highest levels of jobless in the country and almost half of the boroughs are listed in the 50 most deprived local authorities in the land. Further south, and Hastings in East Sussex has similar concentrations of child poverty to Tower Hamlets in London and Sheffield.
The divide is of course real enough, but it’s not a simple case of geography, and we can see this on our own doorstep by comparing Bradford with its affluent neighbour, Leeds.
There’s always been a rivalry between the two and in the heyday of the wool trade Bradford was way out in front. Now, a running joke is that the city centre is a hole; literally. The recession has put paid to a master plan for its regeneration, which lies in tatters alongside demolished buildings that were supposed to be replaced by a big new shopping centre. Instead they have been replaced by big new holes and there are doubts whether the Phoenix will ever rise as Leeds continues to prosper.
And it’s a similar picture all over the country. Take the Mile Cross district in Norwich which is home to 31,000 people and includes some of the most deprived areas in England. Drive a few miles and you come across Norwich city centre which in every respect is similar to well-heeled York.
Drug abuse, criminal damage and antisocial behaviour are no respecters of geography. While there’s grinding poverty in Liverpool and Manchester, if you want to find some of the worst unemployment blackspots in England, head for the south coast. And while you are there take a look at leafy Fareham which overlooks Portsmouth harbour. This is staunch Tory territory and Labour doesn’t even hold a council seat, but behind the façade, a joint project between the council and church is converting a former off-licence into a drop-in centre. Why? Because it’s in Fareham Park in the north-west of the borough, one of the most deprived regions in the country and in the worst five per cent in terms of jobs and skills.
You can’t get further south than Cornwall which, despite its reputation as a millionaire’s playground, is one of the poorest areas in Britain, and one of only four areas in the UK to qualify for poverty-related grants from the EU.
It’s always been a habit for southerners to cock a snook at those of us who live in the wilds of North Yorkshire. But when their jobs are relocated to God’s own county it must come as a bit of a shock to discover the truth.
North-south divide? I don’t think so."

[MB London]

by comparing Bradford with its affluent neighbour, Leeds.

[beemerbird]

Oh Paul, you've already brought forth the ignorance of the situation in Mason's post. Little does he know about the many millionaires and affluent people living in and around Leeds postcodes. Many affluent Jewish people in Leeds Mason.

Paul, you're right with your observations and York of course is a far more desireable area to live than the vast* majority of the Hull City boundary area, but then there are many variations outside of Hull ie in East Riding as you know, hence most people in Hull strive to afford to live in the East Riding for the standard of living and the schools.

I knew all too well about the pockets of areas around Norwich and other further south areas. London is well, London shall we say and all that entails.

You only have to travel around the country with your eyes open to make you realise that it's best to stay put. Think it is very wrong for anyone to assume that a whole vast area of the country is all bad, just doesn't work like that as anyone with half a brain knows.

Good and bad everywhere north or south.

* No I'm going to edit that because Hull is changing and all for the better, still some way to go but change is happening.

[- Paul -]

I'm playing Devils advocate by posting it really...

It does have some salient points though. I.e - the North South divide shouldn't really exist.

There are huge swathes of "crap" areas all over the country.

[RockIt]

Originally Posted by MB London

by comparing Bradford with its affluent neighbour, Leeds.

Funny because?

[AlanQS]

North-south.?!

It's all relative I suppose but to me your north-south divide is simply south-further south.

[Em135eye]

Bit more east/west in Scotland!

[beemerbird]

Originally Posted by - Paul -

I'm playing Devils advocate by posting it really...

It does have some salient points though. I.e - the North South divide shouldn't really exist.

There are huge swathes of "crap" areas all over the country.

[MB London]

Originally Posted by RockIt

Funny because?

I don't want to ruffle any feathers but I just thought it was funny that Leeds was referred as the affluent neighbour, I mean - WTF does that say about Bradford

Probably sound like a right southern wanker, especially as I have never been to either place

[- Paul -]

Originally Posted by MB London

I don't want to ruffle any feathers but I just thought it was funny that Leeds was referred as the affluent neighbour, I mean - WTF does that say about Bradford

Probably sound like a right southern wanker, especially as I have never been to either place

Which is exactly the point - The viewpoint that Leeds or "insert any Northern town" is a sh*thole is wrong.

[beemerbird]

Originally Posted by MB London

Probably sound like a right southern wanker, especially as I have never been to either place

Aye lad, tha does.

Narks me that WHEN I win the lottery I've got to travel along the M62 to Leeds to meander around a roughly square mile radius of Leeds to visit the AM, Lambo, Ferrari, Bentley and Porsche dealers. The common marques BMW, Audi etc. are hidden elsewhere so not as to lower the tone.

[MB London]

Originally Posted by beemerbird

Aye lad, tha does.

Narks me that WHEN I win the lottery I've got to travel along the M62 to Leeds to meander around a roughly square mile radius of Leeds to visit the AM, Lambo, Ferrari, Bentley and Porsche dealers. The common marques BMW, Audi etc. are hidden elsewhere so not as to lower the tone.

You've got to come to the capital first to get your winnings

[beemerbird]

Originally Posted by MB London

You've got to come to the capital first to get your winnings

Nah, I do it on-line.

[MB London]

Originally Posted by beemerbird

Nah, I do it on-line.

That's a shame I was hoping you would have bought me a pint of shandy

[RagingKileak]

All I can say (as a man born in Harrogate, raised in Leeds and who bought his first house in Bradford) is that whilst London has a fantastic inner city atmosphere (crackheads, murderers, rapists and little wannabe gangsters aside) I wouldn't live there if you fucking paid me.

1 in 10 houses are what I would consider 'barely acceptable' whilst the 0.00001 of those houses that actually do belong to a wealthy/celebrity geezer are basically in areas populated by the most fucking ignorant people on the planet.

Even a Frenchman would nod and say morning if he passed you in the street, but not a fucking Londoner... It's always 'eyes down boys' and just walk in a straight line!!

Matt

[MB London]

Sounds like you know as much about London as I do the north mate

[beemerbird]

Originally Posted by MB London

That's a shame I was hoping you would have bought me a pint of shandy

Any man buy a drink would have to drink something like barmy brew (Newcastle brown ale), say four bottles then I'll wait and pass you the bog roll

[RagingKileak]

Originally Posted by MB London

Sounds like you know as much about London as I do the north mate

I spent most of last year there... My (now passed) stepdad was a North Londoner and a top bloke.

Truth is London a million anonymous people moving at once. Everyone I've ever met there I have got along with, but I hate being on the streets and in the tube... I'm not keen on how it's perpetually a sickening warm either... Only when you attend a northern meet will you finally breathe air mate lol!!

Matt

[MB London]

Originally Posted by RagingKileak

I spent most of last year there... My (now passed) stepdad was a North Londoner and a top bloke.

Truth is London a million anonymous people moving at once. Everyone I've ever met there I have got along with, but I hate being on the streets and in the tube... I'm not keen on how it's perpetually a sickening warm either... Only when you attend a northern meet will you finally breathe air mate lol!!

Matt

There is no doubt that the financial/business districts of London are full of people rushing around calling each other cu*ts as they brush each others shoulders, but that is the same as new York and (I would imagine) most other major financial districts. However, London does have soul. I live in a street in east London where everyone know everyones name and the same families have lived in the same house for generations.

Must admit though I like the sound of breathing in some decent northern air, and might just take you up on that northern meet - as long as no one nicks my designer jeans

[RagingKileak]

Originally Posted by MB London

There is no doubt that the financial/business districts of London are full of people rushing around calling each other cu*ts as they brush each others shoulders, but that is the same as new York and (I would imagine) most other major financial districts. However, London does have soul. I live in a street in east London where everyone know everyones name and the same families have lived in the same house for generations.

Must admit though I like the sound of breathing in some decent northern air, and might just take you up on that northern meet - as long as no one nicks my designer jeans

Well Gav and I will soon be liaising for the next Northern Meet and trust me, it's gonna be the bollocks!!

Matt

[willhollin]

You should try a South West Meet.

[pjs]

Just booked eurotunnrl, under pets has the option for cat, dog or ferret. These southerners watch too much ' last of the summer wine' me thinks