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      03-29-2013, 02:06 AM   #1
Darude
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Cool Delivery of first F10 M5 with M Carbon Ceramic Brakes (with full tech training info)

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Full technical information on M Carbon Ceramic Brakes (with a great comparison to standard M5 brakes).

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OWNER UPDATE: added more driving impressions of the brakes below.

Taking delivery tomorrow of what I believe to be the first M5 with M Carbon Ceramic Brakes (full technical details). The dealer has taken a few photos to wet my appetite.

I will post more pictures of delivery and a review of my first impressions.

I have taken the week off work to drive the car and to get 1200 miles covered so the run in service can be done, before driving the car through Europe and experiencing the full power.

Can anyone give me some advice on what to look for when taking delivery and inspecting the car?


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UPDATE!


I've just finished a 2 day 1200 mile road trip with the new beast. We took in South England, Wales, the Lake District and Scotland, whilst driving the car on some of the best driving roads in Britain.

I will follow this post which includes pictures with a full and detailed review, but I am sure you would like to know how the CCB performed? I was told that they required 600 miles to bed in and give proper braking performance. I was driving in temps from +7 to -4 on all roads types and surfaces and the brakes performed faultlessly, the modulation and feel was fantastic, the stopping power phenomenal. Brake squeal? I only heard this when driving slowly (stopping in traffic under 10mph) with the windows down or sunroof open, never with the windows closed, it didn't matter if the brakes were cold, wet, frozen or even after a solid 11 hours driving they were immense. Now, I cant compare the CCB's to the standard steel rotors as I haven't driven these with anger over 1200 miles.

The car goes in for its 1200 mile run in service on Wednesday before being driven to France & Switzerland.

I will write more including a review of my thoughts on all aspects of the cars performance and functions over the next few days.

I would like to say thanks to IND for shipping the all important black gloss kit to the UK.



UPDATE #2

Just got the car back after the run in service. The car now sounds amazing, more pops and crackles especially when lifting off and changing down from 2nd to 1st. Interestingly the technician confirmed that during the run in service the turbos are not at full boost and after the run in service is deactivated the turbos are at max boost pressure.

Ok, for everyone that has a negative impression of the CCB's... My onboard service says that the discs never need replacing and last the lifetime of the car and the brake pads need changing in 100,000 miles! Now opting for these brakes isn't everyones choice, but for such a heavy and powerful car with the style of cross European driving I do with monthly track sessions these brakes are more than worth it for me. I wonder how many people have ever driven cars with 2nd or 3rd gen CCB?

The 23 kilo weight saving which is importantly unsprung makes a sizeable difference to the handling of the car. For me spending the money on the CCB was a no brainer but spending 3700 on the B&O system made no sense on a drivers car as I rarely use the stereo when driving.

Each to their own thats why we all have differently specced and coloured M5's!




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      03-29-2013, 06:32 AM   #2
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2013 BMW ///M5  [0.00]
There is a full checklist located in the pricing-ED thread, stickied at the top

See: http://f10.m5post.com/forums/forumdisplay.php?f=424
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      03-29-2013, 07:04 AM   #3
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Congrats! Question, in the pics the ceramic rotors appear smaller in diameter than the stock steel rotors. Are they smaller? Also do you have a pic of the rear rotor/caliper? Thanks!
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      03-29-2013, 09:15 AM   #4
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Sorry, the dealer didn't take any pictures of the rear rotors, I will post some once I've taken delivery this weekend. The front disc is 1 cm larger than the steel discs, the rears are the same, or so BMW have told me, I also spoke with an M specialist at the Geneva motor show 2 weeks ago where they had the CCB on the new M6 gran coupe and he also confirmed they were 1cm larger on the front. Interestingly, he said that the actual braking performance wasn't significantly better with the CCB, but resisted fade much better for aggressive driving, with no brake dust. He mentioned the unsprung weight had a big difference on the driving characteristics and pointed out that the actual discs have been designed to last the lifetime of the car! They have been running an M5 in house continuously, which has over 400,000km with the same discs. This should help recoup some of the 7600...
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      03-29-2013, 10:04 AM   #5
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Like.
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      03-29-2013, 11:44 AM   #6
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      03-29-2013, 11:59 AM   #7
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Looks awesome! Let us know how they feel! I already love the feel of the stock brakes, almost couldn't imagine the CCB's and how different the car drives with less weight at the four corners and greater stopping power.
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      03-29-2013, 07:28 PM   #8
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Hmmmmm. Never looked at it that way. Retrofit???
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      03-29-2013, 08:05 PM   #9
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Quote:
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Hmmmmm. Never looked at it that way. Retrofit???
My SA said it was possible at $5k per rotor....
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      03-29-2013, 09:37 PM   #10
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My SA said it was possible at $5k per rotor....
Bahahaha F+#* that.
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      03-29-2013, 09:38 PM   #11
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What happens if they warp? Lol
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      03-30-2013, 01:39 AM   #12
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Warping is impossible, they would crack before warping. BMW say to damage them you would have to have a serious crash, then your damaged discs are the least of your problems.
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      03-30-2013, 03:35 AM   #13
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Hi Darude, I think our CCB specced cars were both built at the same time. Mine is ready to collect also but sadly I can't get to the dealership to pick up until 8th April (long story)!

Will be watching this thread with fascination and look forward to comparing notes :-)
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      03-30-2013, 05:23 AM   #14
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Darude View Post
Taking delivery tomorrow of what I believe to be the first M5 with CCB. The dealer has taken a few photos to wet my appetite.
If the braking power of the carbon brakes is as good as the metal version when cold, and then really do hold up well with repeated hard stops of this very heavy car, well worth the money for those who will have the need. I didn't have the budget for them or they would have been on my list. I'll be interested to hear what you think of them.
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      03-30-2013, 06:47 AM   #15
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Darude View Post
Warping is impossible, they would crack before warping. BMW say to damage them you would have to have a serious crash, then your damaged discs are the least of your problems.
One area you should be extra careful are wheel changes. Ie you may want to avoid the run of the mill tire/wheel shops.
Any chip, slight ding to the CCB discs will require them to be replaced.
BMW has actually a special tool for wheel installation for CCB equipped cars so the
wheel is put on perfectly straight and centered.
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      03-30-2013, 07:43 AM   #16
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they actually made them uglier than the non CC calipers.
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      03-30-2013, 11:25 AM   #17
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Just one question. Why?
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      03-30-2013, 11:40 AM   #18
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Quote:
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One area you should be extra careful are wheel changes. Ie you may want to avoid the run of the mill tire/wheel shops.
Any chip, slight ding to the CCB discs will require them to be replaced.
BMW has actually a special tool for wheel installation for CCB equipped cars so the
wheel is put on perfectly straight and centered.
it's a very hard disc. Have had CCB's on both my porsche (GT3) and 2 Ferrari's (Challenge Stradale and F430) with many tire changes with no issues. It's really no concern.

Most carbon ceramic brakes only take 1 or 2 stops to warm up in the morning. It's not as bad as everybody think it is. No brake dust and very repeatable stopping distance is great. They do wear out though. I just went through the brakes on my F430 and the replacement is expensive but that's after 10+ track days.

to the OP great choice. Too bad it wasn't available when I ordered my F10.
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      03-31-2013, 10:42 AM   #19
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Just one question. Why?
Seriously - what possible reason would you have for having ceramic brakes on a 4,500 lb luxury sedan? Much more expensive upfront, more easily damaged, much less progressive feel on the road, won't really work well until they've gotten up to temperature, catastrophic failure mode, much noisier and way more expensive to replace. I guess if you think they look cool and can tell everyone that you have ceramic brakes would be the main reason, no?
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      03-31-2013, 11:23 AM   #20
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Quote:
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Seriously - what possible reason would you have for having ceramic brakes on a 4,500 lb luxury sedan? Much more expensive upfront, more easily damaged, much less progressive feel on the road, won't really work well until they've gotten up to temperature, catastrophic failure mode, much noisier and way more expensive to replace. I guess if you think they look cool and can tell everyone that you have ceramic brakes would be the main reason, no?
I think the clue to your incredulity, is the fact you refer to the M5 as a 'luxury sedan'.

Can't speak for the OP, but as my car arrives next week, also specced with CCBs, the reason I took this option is because the car will actually not represent for me a 'luxury sedan', if I'd wanted that I'd have bought a 7 series.

The car will be a daily performance drive for me and be suitable for my line of work, but at weekends it will also and more importantly, become purely a performance drive and surely the reason the car exists in the first place? Last time I looked M stood for Motorsport

Come on, the M5 was built with performance in mind, not with luxury in mind, that to me is secondary. And in fact, just as the M3 CSL had shameful standard single pot brakes fitted to it when it was released back in 2003, it can be properly argued that the M5 should have CCB as standard now if it to truly deliver on it's promises of power and performance.
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      03-31-2013, 11:43 AM   #21
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Quote:
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I think the clue to your incredulity, is the fact you refer to the M5 as a 'luxury sedan'.

Can't speak for the OP, but as my car arrives next week, also specced with CCBs, the reason I took this option is because the car will actually not represent for me a 'luxury sedan', if I'd wanted that I'd have bought a 7 series.

The car will be a daily performance drive for me and be suitable for my line of work, but at weekends it will also and more importantly, become purely a performance drive and surely the reason the car exists in the first place? Last time I looked M stood for Motorsport

Come on, the M5 was built with performance in mind, not with luxury in mind, that to me is secondary. And in fact, just as the M3 CSL had shameful standard single pot brakes fitted to it when it was released back in 2003, it can be properly argued that the M5 should have CCB as standard now if it to truly deliver on it's promises of power and performance.
I don't mean to disparage the performance aspect of the F10. It is an amazing performance car. But it is also a 4500 lb. luxury sedan. I guess most people equate carbon ceramic brakes with 'performance'.

I race with quite a few Porsche 996 and 997 Cup cars, and 90% of them have steel brakes for the track. For people looking for every tenth of a second we can get on the track, there are much better ways to spend your money. If steel slotted rotors are good enough for racing, why do you need all the headaches and problems that ceramic brakes bring for street cars?

Ceramic brakes have one major advantage over steel - they don't fade with intense use. However, properly designed steel rotors with the right cooling, fluid, calipers and size will not fade on the track. Steel rotors have better feel than ceramics, and are more progressive, and when they wear out, they do it gradually. Ceramics are quite dangerous in their failure mode, so you have to be very careful.

If you're intent on heavy tracking of your M5, then I would question your judgement in general, but yes you might justify ceramics. You would have just as good track performance and much better street use if you upgraded the fluid, rotors and calipers to one of the top brands. Other than the generic "Well, 'M' is about performance, and that must mean ceramic brakes", I don't see the reason for ceramic brakes on the F10.
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      03-31-2013, 02:26 PM   #22
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Full Explanation of M Carbon Ceramic Brake System
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